Author Topic: Missing out with a VST?  (Read 543 times)

Offline VandalX

Missing out with a VST?
« on: March 30, 2018, 01:14:48 AM »
So I am in week three or so with AD2 and I'm loving it. Really great sounds and tweaks available. I've noticed now that I'm using a laptop-based VST, that I rarely if ever adjust anything on my module. I re-mapped all the drums in the midi map section of AD2 to match my setup (DM10 MKII Pro), and those settings were saved so they load with every session regardless of what kits I play/edit/create in the VST. My question is this: am I missing some added functionality and back end tweaks that would make my final creation sound even better? If I'm adjusting velocity curves and similar in AD2, is adjusting those settings in the module gaining anything before the data is sent to the computer? Other things like volume, sensitivity etc. are all set from before I ported it all through the laptop, so I haven't changed those settings. Would I be refining my sound further by fiddling with those?

Perhaps related...is there any way to adjust the hi hat pedal so it's semi-open and doesn't require foot pressure? I'd like to get a splashy sound, but not fully open and not have to keep my foot at a constant pressure. I know it's possible with a full hi hat rig, but the one that came with the kit is the separate pedal and mounted hi hat cymbal, so I don't have a physical adjustment to the hi hat stand to achieve this. Something I miss from the acoustic experience.
Alesis DM 10 MKII Pro (with Tama Iron Cobra double). Pearl Export acoustic. Fostex VF160EX Digital multitrack (16). Fostex monitors. Roland TR-626 drum machine. Roland Juno 106 Poly synth. Aria Knight Warrior. Peavy Fury. Digitech GNX3000. Digitech RP360. Tascam Porta 05 four track. MacBook Air.

Offline Purpledc

Re: Missing out with a VST?
« Reply #1 on: April 30, 2018, 05:04:41 PM »
Stick with the VST.   Its will do the same things but better.   Honestly?  that's why I got rid of that kit.   The module actually gives you infinite control.  It just doesn't do it that well.   I wanted VST like performance but in a module and the strike was the closest fit to that desire.  Take for instance Decay.   On your module, if you try to reduce the decay time on a sample it really has disastrous consequences.  The same I found to be on many of its editing features.  Basically they give you a whole WORLD of control that just doesn't work all that well or how it actually should.    Your VST if triggering great has only two real downsides and those are lower reliability and a more complicated live set up.   The ONLY real downside to what you did is you paid a premium for a module you really didn't need.  But those big pads were a nice take away.  But seriously, doing one thing in the module only to do it again in the VST?  No way.  Keep it pure and use the best tools in your belt.  That right now is AD2.     
« Last Edit: April 30, 2018, 05:43:14 PM by Purpledc »

Offline VandalX

Re: Missing out with a VST?
« Reply #2 on: April 30, 2018, 05:49:29 PM »
That's pretty much what I was thinking. Now that I've had AD2 for a couple months, I've rarely looked at my module, except for the few settings under "trigger" that seem to move over to the VST. But yeah, the tweaking and refining I can do in AD2 is quantum leaps from what I was experiencing in the module alone. Now that I know a good deal more about how the e-drum system works (or is supposed to work), I regret not building something from the ground up. But I have the pads (and a LOT of them due to Alesis' gracious replacement program) and I've fixed all the broken parts, so it's all working out okay. I've got my external USB interface, a dedicated laptop and no latency. It's probably as good as it gets for now.
Alesis DM 10 MKII Pro (with Tama Iron Cobra double). Pearl Export acoustic. Fostex VF160EX Digital multitrack (16). Fostex monitors. Roland TR-626 drum machine. Roland Juno 106 Poly synth. Aria Knight Warrior. Peavy Fury. Digitech GNX3000. Digitech RP360. Tascam Porta 05 four track. MacBook Air.

Offline Purpledc

Re: Missing out with a VST?
« Reply #3 on: April 30, 2018, 05:53:10 PM »
I think you got the right idea. And as a plus, if you do every have to use just the module you probably have enough skills to get in their and know how to squeeze some good sounds out of it if you had to.

Offline AlanK

Re: Missing out with a VST?
« Reply #4 on: May 01, 2018, 09:52:48 AM »
Guys just don't forget you still need to have your module dialed in as best as possible to begin with. If your triggering settings etc are off on the module, AD2 isn't going to function to its best ability. You can't have your module set with Sensitivity of 1 or 2 or Threshold at 99 and assume AD will take care of things.. it's only as good as your module output. Of course, once you've got the module dialed in and all your pads and cymbals are coming through nicely, then AD2 will take it up above and beyond.

Vandal, I'm pretty sure you could adjust your hi-hat trim settings to have the all open give a slightly closed sound, but it would be some adjusting probably in both module and Addictive. I thought I did this when I was originally just using the module (so I could do some cool double kick and not have a completely wide open hi-hat. In AD2, I've toyed with the hi-hat calibrations and had some success, but also have changed things enough that it degraded and I had the darndest time getting it back to functional, so would have to delete the profile and start back with a DM10X default (unfortunately each time I do that I've got to re-map my extra floor tom and added cymbals but it doesn't take long).

With all that said, I'm a major AD2 fan and in the couple years I've had it I think I've maybe gone back to the basic module alone only a couple times. I've also had AD2 crash on me or send my pc into blue screen on occasion.. don't know if it was just overloaded.. too many hits to process.. I've never tried to check logs or anything when it busts on me but I sure wouldn't rely on it in a performance scenario but aside from that, Addictive is mind blowing compared to the module alone and I have to wonder if I would even need to upgrade to the Strike module..I'd like the kit, but if I'm always using a VST will the new module perform even better than my DM10?
DM10X with Addictive Drums 2, Pro X hi-hat, 4 crashes, 682 white mesh cone conversion, Laurin Drums snare and kick, Mapex P710W double kick pedal, Tama saddle, Panasonic noise cancelling headphones, Behringer 8 channel USB mixer, Tascam 144MK AI, Samson Expedition Escape powered speakers

Offline VandalX

Re: Missing out with a VST?
« Reply #5 on: May 01, 2018, 12:30:13 PM »
Thanks, Alan/Purple. As you indicated, I have adjusted the trigger settings in the module in real time as it plays through AD2. That's how I discovered what controls are relevant and which don't make a difference. The individual trigger settings are one place that cross over to the VST, and in the "Kit" edit section, I've only found "midi Note" and Minimum Velocity" as editable features that affect AD2 processing. Bear in mind, I have the DM10 MKII Pro, so these functions were satisfactory at best in the module alone. I can't do the cool things the OG DM 10 or Strike module can do. But in the end, bypassing most of the Alesis ecosystem and working with AD2 is how I get my best results. I have a feeling I'll become a VST addict, and my next target is SSD5 if and when it's actually released independent of Mimic. I did like the EZ Drummer 2 demo, but AD2 seemed more well-rounded. I might look into SD2 once finances allow.

Of course, getting a module that can load a VST kit would be amazing for live applications, though I've only experienced one AD2 failure so far. For some reason, the "Audio/Midi" section reset and the sample rate defaulted to an empty selection. I just reselected my chosen sample rate and it came back online. It's one of those mysterious things that give you pause if stability and robust performance is required.

I'll play around with my hi hat settings to see if I can approximate a semi-open splash sound without using the footboard.

Thanks to all for the input!
Alesis DM 10 MKII Pro (with Tama Iron Cobra double). Pearl Export acoustic. Fostex VF160EX Digital multitrack (16). Fostex monitors. Roland TR-626 drum machine. Roland Juno 106 Poly synth. Aria Knight Warrior. Peavy Fury. Digitech GNX3000. Digitech RP360. Tascam Porta 05 four track. MacBook Air.