What have I gotten myself into?!?

[ragendem]

Hello everyone!

I'm here because I got a secondhand kit and I need some help to get it up and running. It seems I am in good company, so I'm hoping I can find what I need 

Someone in my area posted a Nitro Mesh kit for $100 and it looked like it was barely used. Only thing is they had lost the hi-hat control pedal. I did a quick search and saw several aftermarket pedal's could be had for around $50, so I thought it was a pretty good deal and grabbed it for my daughter who is just getting into playing drums.

Sure enough the kit looks brand new, but the hi-hat control pedal I got for it (Kat KT-HC2) doesn't work with the kit, despite people on several sites saying it worked for them. I see I can get a DMHat2 for $150 but that seems like a lot to pay for a discontinued controller that a lot of people are unhappy with...

So now I'm here hoping I can figure this out and get my daughter's set up and running! See you all in the threads!

[Chaser]

Hello everyone!

I'm here because I got a secondhand kit and I need some help to get it up and running. It seems I am in good company, so I'm hoping I can find what I need 

Someone in my area posted a Nitro Mesh kit for $100 and it looked like it was barely used. Only thing is they had lost the hi-hat control pedal. I did a quick search and saw several aftermarket pedal's could be had for around $50, so I thought it was a pretty good deal and grabbed it for my daughter who is just getting into playing drums.

Sure enough the kit looks brand new, but the hi-hat control pedal I got for it (Kat KT-HC2) doesn't work with the kit, despite people on several sites saying it worked for them. I see I can get a DMHat2 for $150 but that seems like a lot to pay for a discontinued controller that a lot of people are unhappy with...

So now I'm here hoping I can figure this out and get my daughter's set up and running! See you all in the threads!

Welcome to the Forum !

The Kat KT-HC2 was designed for the KT3M Module which is a Medeli Re-Brand...basically the same series used for the 2nd Gen Nitro/Surge.(3rd Gen is NEW BFD Powered Module)
This is the only series that sends a 1/2 open MIDI Note (23) and uses this type of Pedal.
The MIDI Mapping even matches exactly.
The Surge Kit is the Nitro..upgraded ..Triggers..Rack..hardware etc etc...both use the same module
The Kat KT-HC2 Pedal design is similar ..if not the same as posted in this Topic ...only the Pedal Housing/Top pedal are different aesthetically.
The Kat KT-HC2 is based on the early DMHat V2..which is/was the Realhat Pedal Housing (Plastic/Metal Base) with the Newer segmented linear softpot.
These were included with the 2nd Gen Surge Kit...the Newer Oval style Pedals started with the SE Kits.
In actuality..there were 3 versions of the DMHat...a switch type..and (2) versions with a segmented Linear Softpot with different housings/Top Pedal.
The earliest version V1 used an All Plastic Housing and a simple switch with a Tab that flipped on/off..the next version used the Realhat Housing (Plastic/metal Base) with the softpot..the Newer Version Oval uses the same softpot however went back to the original V1 All Plastic Housing..and one uses a 1/4 Jack (Surge)..the Nitro 1/8.There are multiple Re-Brands of the Pedal..KAT..Millenium..Alesis and possibly others.It is hard to keep track of all of them.

A large amount (if not all) of the info for all of the previous kits has become increasingly harder and harder to reference as it has been removed from Alesis.com since the migration to alesisdrums.com



I don't know how familiar you are with E-Drum Kits.
The Pedals don't put out a signal..they are  a linear resistor/softpot.
The Voltage comes in from the Module and the pedal position determines the amount of resistance in the Hi Hat Circuit.
The HH Input (Cymbal) and HH Controller (Pedal) are tied together in a Circuit.

These type of pedals tend to have a lot of Travel before the rubber actuator engages therefore requires constant pressure to go from Closed to 1/2 Open to Full Open , which all happens in a very short period of time/distance..basically as soon as you stop applying pressure and start lifting your foot the Hi hat Circuit will go Full Open quickly...

Pedal UP..strike the cymbal...You should have Full Open.
Pedal DOWN...Hold the pedal down Firmly..strike the Cymbal and it should be Closed.
Release  some pressure/lift the pedal while striking the Cymbal and you'll find the 1/2 open.
It takes practice and a little finesse..
I would double check before looking into another pedal.There is a common misunderstanding that E-Drum pedals work like Acoustic HH Pedals..they don't.
I don't know what HH settings you have changed , but if you want to start from scratch...reset the Module..

NITRO/SURGE FACTORY RESET.

 To restore a Nitro module to its factory default settings hold the < and > arrow buttons simultaneously while powering on the unit.

The screen will show "RST---" for one second and then the module will restore back to the factory default settings and be ready to use.

EDIT:
Added Image.. Links

[ragendem]

Thanks so much for the detailed reply ? I really appreciate you taking the time to explain things so thoroughly. It's clear you know a lot about these kits, and that kind of firsthand knowledge is hard to find, especially with how much info has disappeared from Alesis?s sites.

I'm not very familiar with electronic drum kits (this is my first time working with one), but I?m learning a lot! Reading your explanation here and in the linked posts, I now understand that the hi-hat pedal works as a variable resistor ? not a switch like I first thought - and the module reads this resistance to determine whether the hi-hat should sound open, half open, or closed when the hi-hat pad is triggered.

Here?s what I?ve been able to figure out so far:

I'm using a Kat KT-HC2 pedal with a TRS 1/4" to 1/8" adapter to connect it to the Nitro Mesh module.

Using a multimeter (and some help from ChatGPT), I tested the resistance between various parts of the TRS plug:

Tip → Ring shows a steady ~10kΩ regardless of pedal position.

Ring → Sleeve shows a gradual increase in resistance as I press the pedal, from ~0Ω up to ~100kΩ.

That suggests the pedal?s softpot is functional, but its internal wiring might not match what the Nitro module expects (i.e., the module might be looking for variable resistance between Tip and Ring, not Ring and Sleeve).

Based the post you linked to about the DMHat v2, it sounds like the KT-HC2 may be wired in a similar way, but that signal might be routed through the different contacts for this module. Or maybe I just got a faulty unit.

So now I?m weighing my options:

• Try a custom TRS cable or adapter that swaps Tip and Ring to see if that gets the resistance into the path the module reads - I'm not sure if that will fix the issue with the resistance being in the wrong direction.
• Open up the pedal and rewire it internally, assuming I can trace the connections and it looks straightforward enough.
• Or just look for a known-compatible pedal, an option that is looking more and more likely as I go.

Thanks again ? your info has really helped me understand what?s going on under the hood. I?m a lot closer to getting this set working for my daughter than I was when I started!

[Chaser]

Thanks so much for the detailed reply ? I really appreciate you taking the time to explain things so thoroughly. It's clear you know a lot about these kits, and that kind of firsthand knowledge is hard to find, especially with how much info has disappeared from Alesis?s sites.

I'm not very familiar with electronic drum kits (this is my first time working with one), but I?m learning a lot! Reading your explanation here and in the linked posts, I now understand that the hi-hat pedal works as a variable resistor ? not a switch like I first thought - and the module reads this resistance to determine whether the hi-hat should sound open, half open, or closed when the hi-hat pad is triggered.

Here?s what I?ve been able to figure out so far:

I'm using a Kat KT-HC2 pedal with a TRS 1/4" to 1/8" adapter to connect it to the Nitro Mesh module.

Using a multimeter (and some help from ChatGPT), I tested the resistance between various parts of the TRS plug:

Tip → Ring shows a steady ~10kΩ regardless of pedal position.

Ring → Sleeve shows a gradual increase in resistance as I press the pedal, from ~0Ω up to ~100kΩ.

That suggests the pedal?s softpot is functional, but its internal wiring might not match what the Nitro module expects (i.e., the module might be looking for variable resistance between Tip and Ring, not Ring and Sleeve).

Based the post you linked to about the DMHat v2, it sounds like the KT-HC2 may be wired in a similar way, but that signal might be routed through the different contacts for this module. Or maybe I just got a faulty unit.

So now I?m weighing my options:

• Try a custom TRS cable or adapter that swaps Tip and Ring to see if that gets the resistance into the path the module reads - I'm not sure if that will fix the issue with the resistance being in the wrong direction.
• Open up the pedal and rewire it internally, assuming I can trace the connections and it looks straightforward enough.
• Or just look for a known-compatible pedal, an option that is looking more and more likely as I go.

Thanks again ? your info has really helped me understand what?s going on under the hood. I?m a lot closer to getting this set working for my daughter than I was when I started!

I don't have any of the KAT products to check/Test.The KT3M appears to be a Medeli (DD512-516) rebrand with a lot more Kits/Instruments when compared to the Nitro/Surge.

The measurement for the pedal show be taken at the Tip/Sleeve.
Pedal UP..Fully Open... the reading should be at the highest...87-100kOHM and lowers as you press down.
Pedal DOWN..Completely Closed should read single digits  around/under 10kOHM

If it's the opposite then the pedal has been wired for reverse polarity..some of the Roland designs were that way also.
The ring may have a resistor as did some of the early Alesis Realhat pedals tho there was never an exact explanation why other than balancing/bleeding off Voltage.

Before turning it into a Rocket Science project and risk damage to the current pedal..I would just purchase the correct pedal and sell the other.

I don't know where you are located..if the US I checked ebay and there are numerous V2 Nitro Pedals in the 30-50 range + shipping.
I received numerous "Because you were Interested" discount emails after clicking on a few
including earlier V2 (Realhat Style Housing) for $20 that sold immediately..shipping was 25.
Shipping costs these days are ridiculous.Some of the costs were nearly as high or more than the pedal.

and as an FYI...All drum Modules are TMI..Trigger > MIDI > Interfaces..
The Voltage is interpreted by the Module and converted to MIDI.
The MIDI is then sent to the Sound Generator which is either Internal (Local ON) or External (Local OFF) to an assigned articulation/sample/sound.
Not all Drum Modules have Internal Sound Generators..for example..Alesis Trigger IO,ddrum DDTI..eDRUMin and others.

The New Alesis lineup apparently Auto-Disconnects from the Internal when connected by USB to a Computer for VST/Software etc.
I haven't heard or read any complaints as of yet..however I ran across a mention on Alesis FAQ's page.
Perhaps just their way of explaining the Module doesn't have Bi-Directional USB Audio...altho some do.
I haven't checked All of the New Manuals to see if Local Control Option has been removed

Alesis Drums | Why Wont The Module Output Any Sound When It's Connected To A Computer?

Modified on: Mon, 23 Dec, 2024 at 6:49 PM

When any Alesis drum module is connected to a computer, its internal soundcard is bypassed, and the module operates as a Pad > MIDI converter.

EDIT:
Added Link

[ragendem]

Thanks again for all the help ? your explanation really cleared things up for me. I went back and tested the Tip → Sleeve path like you suggested: the pedal up resistance was 0 Ω, and down was about 10Ω. It wasn't slow like ring/sleeve, it seemed to be all or nothing.

Since I can return the KT-HC2 to Amazon, I?m going to go ahead and do that and check eBay for one of the proper V2 Nitro pedals instead. I?ll update the thread once I get the replacement and have it up and running.

Really appreciate your time and knowledge ? this has been super helpful!

[Chaser]

Thanks again for all the help ? your explanation really cleared things up for me. I went back and tested the Tip → Sleeve path like you suggested: the pedal up resistance was 0 Ω, and down was about 10Ω. It wasn't slow like ring/sleeve, it seemed to be all or nothing.

Since I can return the KT-HC2 to Amazon, I?m going to go ahead and do that and check eBay for one of the proper V2 Nitro pedals instead. I?ll update the thread once I get the replacement and have it up and running.

Really appreciate your time and knowledge ? this has been super helpful!

Amazon is always very good about returns..tho I know quite a few that abuse it..

There is something wrong somewhere...or the KAT pedal is actually using the ring.
I noticed the very poor rating on Amazon of 1.9..but not one review on what the complaint is/was
or the module it was being used/tested with etc.

I have both of the Alesis DMHat V2 designs and they each measure the same as shown in the Link to the Topic above..
Full Open = 150kOHM..Closed 1.0kOHM
The pedals were designed to be "Fixed" and non adjustable...however there is just enough room to drop the Triangle/metal plate down to the bottom screw hole and onto the actuator..eliminating all of the travel..measurement then is 87.2-4 kOHM and the pedal is in the range for use with other Alesis Modules...YMMV...depending on the module as there may be gaps in the Hi hat range.



I can't confirm the range for the Module as I haven't had one of the Medeli DD512-516 (Nitro/Surge) for years...originally it was the DM7...over 10 years ago.

I also posted a chart in that Topic showing I could manipulate it to work with the 6 Levels of Open and 2 closed/tight using an eDRUMin.

EDIT:
Added Image