Author Topic: DM10 Module / Strike Ride Compatibility Issues  (Read 480 times)

DM10 Module / Strike Ride Compatibility Issues
« on: June 28, 2021, 11:22:20 AM »
Hi All, long time reader first time poster ;-)

Having fallen head-first down the old ebay rabbit hole recently, I've been cobbling together a kit which currently consists of original DM10 module (not a MKII) together with the frame, drums and cymbals of a salvaged Strike Pro kit sold without the module as "spares or repair".

Having stripped down all the drums and repaired the plates/piezo's/wiring, and determined that two of the three crash cymbals are basically scrap as the plastic was completely shattered across the edge area (I think the previous owner must have been playing with scaffolding poles instead of sticks), I'm now stumped by the ride.

I've had it stripped down and verified that all internals are in one piece and work individually. I get continuity on the bell and edge switches when pressed, and a good response from the piezo.

If I plug Ride 1 into Socket A and Ride 2 into Socket B with bell set to Switch, I get bow and edge triggering together with choke, but zero bell response regardless of impact force or any combination of xtalk settings.

If I swap the cables over and change nothing else, I get bow as normal, a clear bell on the edge switch, and edge/choke function on the bell switch  ???

I've used the cables that came with the module (fully seated) and also two new TRS cables with the same results.

So apparently the ride itself functions on all three triggers, however for some reason not with the cables in the "correct" holes. I've seen other posts suggesting that these two items should be compatible, so I'm a bit stuck.

During testing I also plugged the TRS cables into a dual zone pad to check what actually triggers down the cable directly:
Ride 1 - Head (Nothing) Rim (Bell)
Ride 2 - Head (Bow) Rim (Edge)

A photo of the ride circuit is attached. Everything I can see so far leads me to believe that this should work. It doesn't. My head now hurts....

Edit: Please don't worry about the nasty looking soldering of the edge contact, I had to replace the FPC connector on the PCB as it had sheared off. It looks scrappy but it is solid and functional.
« Last Edit: June 28, 2021, 11:25:40 AM by D3Actual »

Offline Chaser

Re: DM10 Module / Strike Ride Compatibility Issues
« Reply #1 on: June 28, 2021, 11:59:26 AM »
Hi All, long time reader first time poster ;-)

Having fallen head-first down the old ebay rabbit hole recently, I've been cobbling together a kit which currently consists of original DM10 module (not a MKII) together with the frame, drums and cymbals of a salvaged Strike Pro kit sold without the module as "spares or repair".

Having stripped down all the drums and repaired the plates/piezo's/wiring, and determined that two of the three crash cymbals are basically scrap as the plastic was completely shattered across the edge area (I think the previous owner must have been playing with scaffolding poles instead of sticks), I'm now stumped by the ride.

I've had it stripped down and verified that all internals are in one piece and work individually. I get continuity on the bell and edge switches when pressed, and a good response from the piezo.

If I plug Ride 1 into Socket A and Ride 2 into Socket B with bell set to Switch, I get bow and edge triggering together with choke, but zero bell response regardless of impact force or any combination of xtalk settings.

If I swap the cables over and change nothing else, I get bow as normal, a clear bell on the edge switch, and edge/choke function on the bell switch  ???

I've used the cables that came with the module (fully seated) and also two new TRS cables with the same results.

So apparently the ride itself functions on all three triggers, however for some reason not with the cables in the "correct" holes.I've seen other posts suggesting that these two items should be compatible, so I'm a bit stuck.

During testing I also plugged the TRS cables into a dual zone pad to check what actually triggers down the cable directly:
Ride 1 - Head (Nothing) Rim (Bell)
Ride 2 - Head (Bow) Rim (Edge)

A photo of the ride circuit is attached. Everything I can see so far leads me to believe that this should work. It doesn't. My head now hurts....

Edit: Please don't worry about the nasty looking soldering of the edge contact, I had to replace the FPC connector on the PCB as it had sheared off. It looks scrappy but it is solid and functional.

The STRIKE (2) cable Ride is compatible with the original DM10 Module.
In the Original DM10 Module you had the option of setting the 2 cable Ride as Dual or Triple zone.
Check and see if it is set to Dual Zone...
I have also repaired a number of "new" cymbals..STRIKE Rides and Crashes where the connector had been soldered up off the board instead of flush sitting on the board so when it was plugged in the traces actually been pulled off the board..Not very good quality control.

Ride Mode
1) Press EXT TRIG to enter the main Ext. Trig Menu page.
2) Select  the  ride's  bow  or  bell  by  pressing  NOTE  CHASE  then  striking  that  zone  on  your  cymbal  trigger.    Alternatively,  you  can  highlight  the  trigger  name  at  the  top  of  the  screen  using  the  CURSOR UP / DOWN buttons to highlight it and use the VALUE UP/DOWN buttons or VALUE DIAL to select either "RideBell" or "RideBow."
3) Press MODE (F4).
4) Use VALUE UP / DOWN buttons or the VALUE DIAL to select "2 Zones" if your ride cymbal is a dual-zone or "3 Zones" if your ride cymbal is a three-zone.
5) When  you  have  finished  making  your  edits,  you  can  press  EXIT  or  any  button  that  will  enter  another  screen (e.g., DRUM KIT, UTILITY, etc.  Your edits will remain for that session (i.e., until you turn off the module).


Re: DM10 Module / Strike Ride Compatibility Issues
« Reply #2 on: June 28, 2021, 01:45:47 PM »
Thanks for the rapid response Chaser.

Can confirm the module is set to 3 zones.

If I set to 2 zones and leave note chase on, striking the bell triggers prc1hd. If I scroll to prc1rim and set that to switch, it triggers when I grab the edge, further confirming that all the zones will trigger independently.

Offline Chaser

Re: DM10 Module / Strike Ride Compatibility Issues
« Reply #3 on: June 28, 2021, 03:49:45 PM »
Thanks for the rapid response Chaser.

Can confirm the module is set to 3 zones.

If I set to 2 zones and leave note chase on, striking the bell triggers prc1hd. If I scroll to prc1rim and set that to switch, it triggers when I grab the edge, further confirming that all the zones will trigger independently.

The Triple zone (2) cable Ride outputs works as a circuit using both inputs..Ride1 and Perc1.
Ride 1 is bow/bell..Ride2/Perc1 is edge/choke.The Ride has a combination sample pool.You select a Ride sample it is applied to all (Bell/Bow/edge)
If the cables are reversed at the cymbal the Bell will fire the edge and the choke/edge will fire the bell.
The switches are tied to the Piezo if you set the module to dual zone, Ride2/Perc1 is no longer in the Ride circuit...Ride1 and Ride2 are now 2 seperate inputs.If the RideB cable is still connected to Perc1.. the bow will still trigger Perc1 HD however the choke/edge will now trigger whatever is assigned to the rim (usually a percussion sample) as you lose the edge/choke.
If you want to use the 2 separate inputs as dual zone with 2 separate Triggers/Pads a dummy plug must be placed in the RideB output.The cymbal will not function without either a plug or a cable in the RideB output.

The STRIKE Bell has always been difficult to trigger..Bell triggers have to be shanked , the tips not going to do it..lower the sensitivity..increase the threshold for the Bow and raise the sensitivity and lower the threshold for the Bell...or just turn the sensitivity all the way down to zero and the threshold all the way to the max on the Bow..(basically shutting the Bow off) then Max out the sensitivity on the Bell drop the threshold to zero..guarantee the bell will trigger easily then raise the Bow sensitivity up..lower the threshold 
Crosstalk is for 2 triggers in the same proximity on the rack triggering one another...not a Piezo/switch adjustment.

Here is a link to the old DM10 Setup..make sure the module has been set to the proper type of kit,since you are using STRIKE triggers you'll want a Mesh setup..not the Mylar kits..The DM10 Studio Mesh was all 8" with a 10" snare..the DM10 X Mesh was 10/12"..so you'll probably want the DM10 X Mesh and adjust for 8" and 14" if you have all the STRIKE pro toms..



Re: DM10 Module / Strike Ride Compatibility Issues
« Reply #4 on: June 29, 2021, 02:31:01 PM »
The saga continues.

Made sure to return the settings back to 3 zones and tried the suggested values to reduce the bow sensitivity to zero, maxed out the bow threshold, upped the bell sensitivity to max and whacked the hell out of the bell with the shoulder of the stick. Not a single sound apart from the dull thwack of wood on rubber and grunts of frustration from me. ​(Note: no setting for Bell threshold is visible anywhere). Relevant or not, the edge still triggered and choked just fine.

Images of all the settings used for this test attached.

Quote
If the cables are reversed at the cymbal the Bell will fire the edge and the choke/edge will fire the bell.

With settings at 'normal' levels, this is exactly what happens with the cables reversed - yet plug them back in where they should be, absolutely zero bell response.

I'm almost certain there must be some sort of fault within either the module or the ride at this point, as I can get each part of the cymbal to react to a reasonable impact on an individual basis with just the cables swapped, but not the correct way around.

As a further test, I connected up to my laptop and ran midi outputs through Ezdrummer 2. With the ride set to 3 zones I'm getting 51 on the bow and 25 on the edge, with the bell area still firing off a 51 regardless of effort (Bell midi being 53 by default according to Hellfire's midi note map). I switched to 2 zones, set the midi out for Prc1Hd to 53 and Prc1Rim to 59, and aside from obviously having no choke it sounded right - bell on bell, bow on bow, edge on edge (well I need to tweak the levels for better bell/bow separation, but it triggered all three consistently).

I think I'm just going to accept that this is the best I'll get out of the setup I have to hand, unless anyone has any revelations they can share  ;D

Thanks for your efforts Chaser, very much appreciated.

Offline Chaser

Re: DM10 Module / Strike Ride Compatibility Issues
« Reply #5 on: June 29, 2021, 03:57:54 PM »
It's been quite awhile since I setup a DM10 module so I went and pulled one out.
There isn't a threshold for the Bell for this module but there is a ZoneXtalk setting for the Bell for shared inputs..(same for all the rims).
The ability to change input types for the Bell was for the Metal Surge Cymbals which had a Piezo Bell.
I connected a STRIKE Ride and had no issues and it triggered relatively easy regardless if on Piezo or Switch..so there may be an issue with the circuit somewhere as you mentioned the previous owner sounded like a heavy hitter or didn't  have the settings quite right with the cymbal edges being broken
and a repair on the PCB..
The edge switches on all the STRIKE cymbals don't trigger very well as there is a .030 gap between the heavy rubber cap and the switch.I have done a "tape job" on all I have and for others and it helped out quite a bit.

I attached some pics of a STRIKE Ride PCB...see if you find anything helpful.

ZoneXTalk:
This  setting  adjusts  how  susceptible  triggers  on  a  "shared"  input  (e.g.,  the  bell  and  bow of a ride cymbal, or the head and rim of a the same drum pad) are to "crosstalk" from each other.    The  higher  the  setting,  the  less  likely  these  trigger  pairs  will  cause  each  other  to  trigger  unintentionally.  (Note: We recommend increasing this setting for drum pads on which you want to produce "rimshots" by striking the head and rim simultaneously.)
« Last Edit: June 29, 2021, 04:05:31 PM by Chaser »