Author Topic: Strike Module: percussion sets/slave module?  (Read 744 times)

Strike Module: percussion sets/slave module?
« on: April 22, 2020, 12:25:45 PM »
Hi, I wanted to know if it is possible to use a second module chained via MIDI to the strike module to trigger additional sounds?

i know with roland modules they need to have "percussion sets" feature to be able to perform this (ex: Td-9, TD-12, TD-20, TD-30 all have this, TD-50/27 do not), there is no mention of "percussion sets" or "slave" in the strike manual that i can find.

I have an old roland td-6v i connected via MIDI out to MIDI in on the strike and I can trigger the regular strike sounds. What I'm trying to figure out is if there is a way to use it to trigger other sounds / in essence to add inputs to the strike.

i am getting the impression this is unfortunately not possible but wondering if anyone has succeeded in this? maybe at a minimum is there a way to combine this with splitters so that you are able to maintain "choke" cymbal functionality even if splitting inputs? that or just any benefit in chaining modules together via MIDI like this at all

thank you

Online AlanK

Re: Strike Module: percussion sets/slave module?
« Reply #1 on: April 22, 2020, 02:00:21 PM »
I can't speak for the Strike but years ago I had a second DM10 module and some extra crashes and toms. I just used the pair of outs to the other module's auxilary in, since the 2nd module could do the crash/ride chokes they would just be sent over to the 1st module analog style.. worked.. also by setting midi control I was able to add all the pads in the 2nd module in another trial to the 1st by assigning them with unused channels (midi notes?). Both ways worked with the DM10 and I'd imagine one or another of these would work for the Strike. Just a hypothesis tho :)
DM10X with Addictive Drums 2, Pro X hi-hat, 4 crashes, 682 white mesh cone conversion, Laurin Drums snare and kick, Mapex P710W double kick pedal, Tama saddle, Panasonic noise cancelling headphones, Behringer 8 channel USB mixer, Tascam 144MK AI, Samson Expedition Escape powered speakers

Offline Iggford

Re: Strike Module: percussion sets/slave module?
« Reply #2 on: April 23, 2020, 08:56:02 AM »
From what I've heard, as I've not tried it myself, the Strike does not offer any additional MIDI notes, so there wouldn't be a way to plug anything into the MIDI in and get additional capacity.  The best bet may be to run the output from your older module into the AUX IN on the Strike, but that would basically give you the sounds from your TD-6. 

As far as splitting goes with the Strike, it works best to split the TOM inputs and not the cymbals.  The cymbal inputs act kinda funny when split, one of the zones comes out a LOT quieter than the other.  TOM splitting works wonderfully, though.  You do lose the rims, but I didn't use them much anyway.  I've split all mine off to give me 6 toms and a couple percussion pads.  You just have to be careful to split one input into two pads you don't plan on playing together, as you can't play both zones on an input simultaneously.

Hope this helps!


--
Shawn

Online AlanK

Re: Strike Module: percussion sets/slave module?
« Reply #3 on: April 23, 2020, 09:01:20 AM »
Shawn you've got an incredibly tricked out setup!

I can totally agree with the be careful what inputs you split! Back when I was adding multiple extra pads, cymbals.. the first one I split was the kick so I could use kick 2 (on my DM10) and it totally messed up cymbal crashes and I realized of course, you're generally going to hit your kick at the same time as any crash.. tried adjusting priority and mute group settings but then went to using up tom rims as my extra inputs.. live and learn huh
DM10X with Addictive Drums 2, Pro X hi-hat, 4 crashes, 682 white mesh cone conversion, Laurin Drums snare and kick, Mapex P710W double kick pedal, Tama saddle, Panasonic noise cancelling headphones, Behringer 8 channel USB mixer, Tascam 144MK AI, Samson Expedition Escape powered speakers

Offline Iggford

Re: Strike Module: percussion sets/slave module?
« Reply #4 on: April 24, 2020, 08:40:47 AM »
I thought about cutting it down a bit to make it easier for gig transport, but my wife talked me out of it!

I was never much of a rim user when it came to the dual-zone pads, so it wasn't much for me to split those off.  It seemed like splitting was a little less finicky with the DM10.  I don't think I ever split the cymbal inputs, though.  I do wish the Strike had the Kick2 assignment, or at least that it was as straightforward as it was on the DM10.  Unless they've done away with it in the newer updates, it was technically there.  The Kick acted in the module as a single zone input, and the pad is, of course, just a single.  You can technically connect a dual-zone pad to it, enable the note chase function and access the kick rim, though.  Can be a bit of a pain if you're building a kit from the editor software.  I haven't really needed to use it so far, though, so I've for the most part left it alone.  One day...... :)


--
Shawn

Re: Strike Module: percussion sets/slave module?
« Reply #5 on: April 24, 2020, 06:17:11 PM »
thanks for the responses guys.

i did have a chance to play around with it a bit yesterday and while i haven't managed to find a way to add any inputs, i did find one interesting thing.

- i connected my td-6 to the midi in of the strike
- connected a cymbal to the td-6 and set the midi note to crash 3 bow
- set crash 3 edge and bow to 2 different cymbals on the strike

i can play both zones on the cymbal connected to the strike and still use choke, if i play the cymbal one the td-6 i can trigger the bow zone sound but no choke.

wonder if i could diy a single zone chokable cymbal if this could be a way to "add" more cymbals without losing the choke functionality as i do when using drum splitters

Offline Chaser

Re: Strike Module: percussion sets/slave module?
« Reply #6 on: April 24, 2020, 10:01:49 PM »
thanks for the responses guys.

i did have a chance to play around with it a bit yesterday and while i haven't managed to find a way to add any inputs, i did find one interesting thing.

- i connected my td-6 to the midi in of the strike
- connected a cymbal to the td-6 and set the midi note to crash 3 bow
- set crash 3 edge and bow to 2 different cymbals on the strike

i can play both zones on the cymbal connected to the strike and still use choke, if i play the cymbal one the td-6 i can trigger the bow zone sound but no choke.

wonder if i could diy a single zone chokable cymbal if this could be a way to "add" more cymbals without losing the choke functionality as i do when using drum splitters

Different Brands/Modules handle Choke differently..
The STRIKE Module sends "Choke Notes"
The Roland TD-6V sends "AfterTouch"
(The module only sends/receives Key Aftertouch not Channel.)

This is why some of the software Instruments choking was a problem for Roland Modules as they were expecting MIDI Notes and you needed to enable "Aftertouch"..
The TD-6V has 3 MIDI MODES..
In 2 of the MIDI Implementation charts "AfterTouch" is not sent or recognized..
I attached the 3 MIDI Implementation Charts..

There is no MIDI Implementation Chart for the STRIKE Module and I got the old "That is not Public Information" answer when I requested it..not the first time,I received the same response for the DM Dock and others.

Since only one MIDI Mode for the TD-6V sends (also receives) AfterTouch...."NORMAL MODE (Expect Sequencer)"....make sure the module is in that MIDI Mode..

More than likely the STRIKE Module doesn't recognize "AfterTouch"..without the MIDI Implementation Chart it's unknown and I haven't had a chance to connect a keyboard to it.
« Last Edit: April 24, 2020, 11:42:13 PM by Chaser »

Re: Strike Module: percussion sets/slave module?
« Reply #7 on: March 28, 2021, 02:57:51 PM »
thanks for the responses guys.

i did have a chance to play around with it a bit yesterday and while i haven't managed to find a way to add any inputs, i did find one interesting thing.

- i connected my td-6 to the midi in of the strike
- connected a cymbal to the td-6 and set the midi note to crash 3 bow
- set crash 3 edge and bow to 2 different cymbals on the strike

i can play both zones on the cymbal connected to the strike and still use choke, if i play the cymbal one the td-6 i can trigger the bow zone sound but no choke.

wonder if i could diy a single zone chokable cymbal if this could be a way to "add" more cymbals without losing the choke functionality as i do when using drum splitters

Different Brands/Modules handle Choke differently..
The STRIKE Module sends "Choke Notes"
The Roland TD-6V sends "AfterTouch"
(The module only sends/receives Key Aftertouch not Channel.)

This is why some of the software Instruments choking was a problem for Roland Modules as they were expecting MIDI Notes and you needed to enable "Aftertouch"..
The TD-6V has 3 MIDI MODES..
In 2 of the MIDI Implementation charts "AfterTouch" is not sent or recognized..
I attached the 3 MIDI Implementation Charts..

There is no MIDI Implementation Chart for the STRIKE Module and I got the old "That is not Public Information" answer when I requested it..not the first time,I received the same response for the DM Dock and others.

Since only one MIDI Mode for the TD-6V sends (also receives) AfterTouch...."NORMAL MODE (Expect Sequencer)"....make sure the module is in that MIDI Mode..

More than likely the STRIKE Module doesn't recognize "AfterTouch"..without the MIDI Implementation Chart it's unknown and I haven't had a chance to connect a keyboard to it.

long overdue response  but thank you very much for the detailed response chaser! it is consistent with what i've found experimenting with this setup. so i guess i'll need to find a different slave module to use.

would you be familiar with any of the lower end alesis modules to know if they use choke notes or after touch? evidently would prefer something low cost since all i'll be using it for is sending midi to the strike.

thanks! 

Offline DannyM

Re: Strike Module: percussion sets/slave module?
« Reply #8 on: March 28, 2021, 08:31:12 PM »
I had two Command Modules that I would run a cable from the headphone jack on one module to the aux input on the other module and then adjust the volume to match and it worked in order to play or practice.

You probably could not record something on the one module and pick up all the instruments coming from the second module, but just to play out loud it may work for you.

Offline Chaser

Re: Strike Module: percussion sets/slave module?
« Reply #9 on: March 28, 2021, 11:52:34 PM »
thanks for the responses guys.

i did have a chance to play around with it a bit yesterday and while i haven't managed to find a way to add any inputs, i did find one interesting thing.

- i connected my td-6 to the midi in of the strike
- connected a cymbal to the td-6 and set the midi note to crash 3 bow
- set crash 3 edge and bow to 2 different cymbals on the strike

i can play both zones on the cymbal connected to the strike and still use choke, if i play the cymbal one the td-6 i can trigger the bow zone sound but no choke.

wonder if i could diy a single zone chokable cymbal if this could be a way to "add" more cymbals without losing the choke functionality as i do when using drum splitters

Different Brands/Modules handle Choke differently..
The STRIKE Module sends "Choke Notes"
The Roland TD-6V sends "AfterTouch"
(The module only sends/receives Key Aftertouch not Channel.)

This is why some of the software Instruments choking was a problem for Roland Modules as they were expecting MIDI Notes and you needed to enable "Aftertouch"..
The TD-6V has 3 MIDI MODES..
In 2 of the MIDI Implementation charts "AfterTouch" is not sent or recognized..
I attached the 3 MIDI Implementation Charts..

There is no MIDI Implementation Chart for the STRIKE Module and I got the old "That is not Public Information" answer when I requested it..not the first time,I received the same response for the DM Dock and others.

Since only one MIDI Mode for the TD-6V sends (also receives) AfterTouch...."NORMAL MODE (Expect Sequencer)"....make sure the module is in that MIDI Mode..

More than likely the STRIKE Module doesn't recognize "AfterTouch"..without the MIDI Implementation Chart it's unknown and I haven't had a chance to connect a keyboard to it.

long overdue response  but thank you very much for the detailed response chaser! it is consistent with what i've found experimenting with this setup. so i guess i'll need to find a different slave module to use.

would you be familiar with any of the lower end alesis modules to know if they use choke notes or after touch? evidently would prefer something low cost since all i'll be using it for is sending midi to the strike.

thanks!

The Crimson (Based on Medeli  DD650) sends Key after touch...the STRIKE Module doesn't recognize it..
The Medeli DD650 User Guide/MIDI Implementation chart shows it doesn't send Key after touch but it does (attached)..so it may have to do with the different firmware installed on the different  DD650 Re-Brands (Crimson/Crimson II/Command/DM10 MKII Studio/Forge)  as the Crimson supports a Dual Zone Hi Hat..but reports are the Crimson II doesn't and it has different firmware.
I don't have any of the DD512( Nitro/Surge)

The Original DM10 module worked fine when I tested it with the STRIKE Module and you can pick up an Original DM10 for a good price these days and it has  a lot more MIDI features than most of the newer modules...including additional MIDI notes than can be assigned to external triggers.



 

Re: Strike Module: percussion sets/slave module?
« Reply #10 on: March 29, 2021, 04:47:02 PM »
thanks for the responses guys.

i did have a chance to play around with it a bit yesterday and while i haven't managed to find a way to add any inputs, i did find one interesting thing.

- i connected my td-6 to the midi in of the strike
- connected a cymbal to the td-6 and set the midi note to crash 3 bow
- set crash 3 edge and bow to 2 different cymbals on the strike

i can play both zones on the cymbal connected to the strike and still use choke, if i play the cymbal one the td-6 i can trigger the bow zone sound but no choke.

wonder if i could diy a single zone chokable cymbal if this could be a way to "add" more cymbals without losing the choke functionality as i do when using drum splitters

Different Brands/Modules handle Choke differently..
The STRIKE Module sends "Choke Notes"
The Roland TD-6V sends "AfterTouch"
(The module only sends/receives Key Aftertouch not Channel.)

This is why some of the software Instruments choking was a problem for Roland Modules as they were expecting MIDI Notes and you needed to enable "Aftertouch"..
The TD-6V has 3 MIDI MODES..
In 2 of the MIDI Implementation charts "AfterTouch" is not sent or recognized..
I attached the 3 MIDI Implementation Charts..

There is no MIDI Implementation Chart for the STRIKE Module and I got the old "That is not Public Information" answer when I requested it..not the first time,I received the same response for the DM Dock and others.

Since only one MIDI Mode for the TD-6V sends (also receives) AfterTouch...."NORMAL MODE (Expect Sequencer)"....make sure the module is in that MIDI Mode..

More than likely the STRIKE Module doesn't recognize "AfterTouch"..without the MIDI Implementation Chart it's unknown and I haven't had a chance to connect a keyboard to it.

long overdue response  but thank you very much for the detailed response chaser! it is consistent with what i've found experimenting with this setup. so i guess i'll need to find a different slave module to use.

would you be familiar with any of the lower end alesis modules to know if they use choke notes or after touch? evidently would prefer something low cost since all i'll be using it for is sending midi to the strike.

thanks!

The Crimson (Based on Medeli  DD650) sends Key after touch...the STRIKE Module doesn't recognize it..
The Medeli DD650 User Guide/MIDI Implementation chart shows it doesn't send Key after touch but it does (attached)..so it may have to do with the different firmware installed on the different  DD650 Re-Brands (Crimson/Crimson II/Command/DM10 MKII Studio/Forge)  as the Crimson supports a Dual Zone Hi Hat..but reports are the Crimson II doesn't and it has different firmware.
I don't have any of the DD512( Nitro/Surge)

The Original DM10 module worked fine when I tested it with the STRIKE Module and you can pick up an Original DM10 for a good price these days and it has  a lot more MIDI features than most of the newer modules...including additional MIDI notes than can be assigned to external triggers.

ya i knew the dm10 had percussion sets (or the equivalent) but to utilize it you also have to go with the dm10's internal sounds of which i'm not a fan.

oh well, maybe i'll give an edrumin a shot as i understand it's capable of sending either aftertouch or choke notes.

Offline Chaser

Re: Strike Module: percussion sets/slave module?
« Reply #11 on: March 29, 2021, 05:49:48 PM »
Quote

ya i knew the dm10 had percussion sets (or the equivalent) but to utilize it you also have to go with the dm10's internal sounds of which i'm not a fan.

oh well, maybe i'll give an edrumin a shot as i understand it's capable of sending either aftertouch or choke notes.

I wasn't talking about the GM or Percussion section...the DM10 has 35 additional MIDI Notes that can still be assigned..I haven't spent any time with it to see if adding all the external controllers and shutting off Local Control if all the normal MIDI + the Xtra 35 notes would be sent..I presume they would be.

Original DM10 35 additional sounds via MIDI

I currently run the STRIKE module/STRIKE Multipad and an Ipad Pro in a MIDI/Audio loop with the SMP USB to the iPad...the Multipad has an onboard Audio Interface, bi-directional USB Audio/MIDI simultaneously so you only need 5 pin with the module,the module 1/4" outs to the ins on the SMP and the Multipad Mains out to whatever you choose..the SMP also has an additional 20 MIDI notes that can be accessed/assigned without triggers by using the Cue feature.
The iPad Pro has 1TB and 6GB Ram and with the release of iPadOS...you can do nearly as much as with the rolling MIDI racks I have..and 100's of lbs less..easy on the back..lol

I am waiting for Toontrack , XLN etc etc to come out with everything for the M1 chip...then we'll be able to use EZ Drummer , SD3 etc etc on an iPad...eventually..I can currently convert/export SD3 instrument to EXS24 instrument and then Airdrop to Audio Layer and its SSE..but it is a pain and you have to have a Mac..

Offline Joker47

Re: Strike Module: percussion sets/slave module?
« Reply #12 on: May 07, 2021, 05:51:36 PM »
I had two Command Modules that I would run a cable from the headphone jack on one module to the aux input on the other module and then adjust the volume to match and it worked in order to play or practice.

You probably could not record something on the one module and pick up all the instruments coming from the second module, but just to play out loud it may work for you.

I have my DM10 MKii Pro and Strike modules set up exactly like that. Main outs of the Strike to the aux input of the DM10 MKii Pro, and then attach my headphones out of the DM10 MKii Pro.
Works great, and I'll be running them through a mixer when it arrives so I can attach my phone.
Alesis DM10 MKll Pro kit and module; Alesis Strike module; mixer on the way