Author Topic: New Alesis dm10 Studio kit! Triggering into Superior 2.0?  (Read 14840 times)

New Alesis dm10 Studio kit! Triggering into Superior 2.0?
« on: December 27, 2010, 05:10:39 AM »
Hello all! This is my first post, and definitely not last!

I've been lurking this site for a while before getting my kit, and i guess now is the time i join in! :)

Okay, I've been recording myself, and bands for a while now. DAW-Reaper, Guitars into an interface with PodFarm, and using Superior 2.0 for drums. Until now, i have spent the time going over drum parts with drummers and manually clicking in the notes on Superior, and I'm hoping I can finally save a lot of time by using an E-Drum system to knock it out.

My issue:
    My interface does not have any MIDI ins or outs. XLR, Instrument Ins, Line Ins, Footswitches, but no MIDI. I see how the Alesis DM10 module does have a USB, I was wondering if there was any possible way to use this kit for Superior 2.0s triggering via USB.

I really hope so, if not, could someone direct me to the cheapest way to achieve what I want?

Thanks so much!

Offline vaikl

Re: New Alesis dm10 Studio kit! Triggering into Superior 2.0?
« Reply #1 on: December 27, 2010, 06:31:48 AM »
Welcome to the forum!

The simplest way is to connect your DM10 module via USB with your comp (no driver installation needed). Then you'll have a new MIDI device in Reaper and now you can send your played MIDI notes into SD. SD has a number of predefined MIDI note mappings to get the right sounds out of the pads.

There are some other threads here describing it further or dealing with potential problems in SD.
« Last Edit: December 27, 2010, 09:09:01 AM by vaikl »

Re: New Alesis dm10 Studio kit! Triggering into Superior 2.0?
« Reply #2 on: December 27, 2010, 04:27:05 PM »
Okay, so now that i see its possible, how do i get Reaper to read my MIDI device (AlesisDM10) via USB and not MIDI

Offline vaikl

Re: New Alesis dm10 Studio kit! Triggering into Superior 2.0?
« Reply #3 on: December 27, 2010, 06:00:36 PM »
Okay, so now that i see its possible, how do i get Reaper to read my MIDI device (AlesisDM10) via USB and not MIDI

If you plug in your DM10 via USB (and assuming you are on Windows), Windows will automatically assign a generic USB and MIDI driver to it, because the DM10 sends MIDI over USB (only MIDI, nothing else). Stupidly this will often be named "USB Audio Device" - even for MIDI - in the Device Manager.

Reaper should see this new "USB Audio Device" in its list of available MIDI devices.

Re: New Alesis dm10 Studio kit! Triggering into Superior 2.0?
« Reply #4 on: December 27, 2010, 07:30:07 PM »
Okay, so now im one step further hahaha, thanks

Im getting Reaper to read it when i hit things. BUT

1) I cannot hear during recording, or armed. only during playback

2) It is mapped entirely incorrectly, hi hat is triggered when i hit ANY cymbal. its just all out of wack. How would i go about re-routing everything?

Offline vaikl

Re: New Alesis dm10 Studio kit! Triggering into Superior 2.0?
« Reply #5 on: December 27, 2010, 08:07:05 PM »
1) I cannot hear during recording, or armed. only during playback

2) It is mapped entirely incorrectly, hi hat is triggered when i hit ANY cymbal. its just all out of wack. How would i go about re-routing everything?

1.) I'm not a Reaper guy, so i just can give the hint to read the manual parts regarding monitoring of MIDI channels/tracks. Maybe there's a real audio interface with monitoring abilities missing in your setup.

2.) Superior Drummer doesn't glance with a perfect DM10 or even a generic Alesis MIDI map. It's up to you to tweak the best-effort map that is coming with SD. Under the "Mapping" tab you have all possibilities to map your setup to the volitional sounds in SD.

If you are looking for drum software that don't leave you alone with a DIY mapping approach for Alesis products you could try BFD2 or Addictive Drums.

Re: New Alesis dm10 Studio kit! Triggering into Superior 2.0?
« Reply #6 on: December 28, 2010, 07:36:38 PM »
What do you mean by it doesn't glance?

Mapping tab, in SD or on the DM10 module? If in SD how would I tell it that I want my crash on my dm10 should signal so and so within dm10 without note chase or knowing the map that my dm10 is sending out?

Offline vaikl

Re: New Alesis dm10 Studio kit! Triggering into Superior 2.0?
« Reply #7 on: December 28, 2010, 08:08:46 PM »
What do you mean by it doesn't glance?

Mapping tab, in SD or on the DM10 module? If in SD how would I tell it that I want my crash on my dm10 should signal so and so within dm10 without note chase or knowing the map that my dm10 is sending out?

Your DM10 sends a pre-configured MIDI note for every trigger (you can change this in the module, yes, but you don't have to). Select a corresponding instrument in the SD mapping tab, click the "Learn" button in the upper right, play your trigger, done.
Do this mapping for every DM10 trigger/SD instrument couple, save the completed map under "presets", "MIDI", "Save as.." and you have a DM10 key map for SD.

A pre-configured SD key map for the DM10 could spare this manual work for every trigger/instrument pair, but unfortunately there is no such DM10 map in the factory setup. You can try the other available SD maps like "GM" or "Edrums" to see how far it will support the DM10 setup.

The other way round to customize the MIDI notes in the DM10 module is by far not so intuitive as the above method.

Re: New Alesis dm10 Studio kit! Triggering into Superior 2.0?
« Reply #8 on: December 29, 2010, 01:44:10 PM »
As vaikl said, you just need to start with choosing (for instance) the kick in S2.0 and click on "Learn" then hit your kick drum ... Snare / Learn - hit your snare and so on until S2.0 has mapped all of your pads and cymbals.

Otherwise, it should have been close right out of the box.


Mark

Re: New Alesis dm10 Studio kit! Triggering into Superior 2.0?
« Reply #9 on: December 30, 2010, 03:52:42 AM »
Thanks guys, I feel dumb now, I have superior preset that I've created a while back.

Now another problem.

It's not letting my two crashes trigger separate things. I'll learn left crash to my crash 1 and then right crash to me crash 2. Then my crash 1 will trigger the right crash as well. I cannot find any way to let them trigger separately into superior. Same thing happens with my right rack Tom and floor Tom... Getting quite frustrated.

Offline vaikl

Re: New Alesis dm10 Studio kit! Triggering into Superior 2.0?
« Reply #10 on: December 30, 2010, 11:47:06 AM »
Now another problem.

It's not letting my two crashes trigger separate things. I'll learn left crash to my crash 1 and then right crash to me crash 2. Then my crash 1 will trigger the right crash as well. I cannot find any way to let them trigger separately into superior. Same thing happens with my right rack Tom and floor Tom... Getting quite frustrated.

All triggering and therefor all problems take place in the DM10 hardware and the module software, so SD is uninvolved in false/double triggering.

If you hit your crash or tom pad, how many highlighted notes on the piano roll in SD do you see? If more than one then you'll have to check crosstalking/sensivity on the module.

Re: New Alesis dm10 Studio kit! Triggering into Superior 2.0?
« Reply #11 on: December 31, 2010, 04:40:04 AM »
yeah, i did notice that at first, so i did change some sensitivity issues. But after that was resolved i made sure only one was being highlighted at a time.

Not sure exactly what you mean by "crosstalk" i guess ill look into that then?

Or sense i made it to where only one highlights, would it be unnecessary?

Offline vaikl

Re: New Alesis dm10 Studio kit! Triggering into Superior 2.0?
« Reply #12 on: December 31, 2010, 02:37:41 PM »
Not sure exactly what you mean by "crosstalk" i guess ill look into that then?

Or sense i made it to where only one highlights, would it be unnecessary?

You can read about crosstalk in the DM10 manual starting with page 24 or using the search function in the forum, you'll get a good number of threads.

Re: New Alesis dm10 Studio kit! Triggering into Superior 2.0?
« Reply #13 on: January 09, 2011, 03:24:49 AM »
been busy for a while but finally got some time to look into crosstalk,  well that was not the problem either. i am sooooo stumped!!!  :'(

Offline vaikl

Re: New Alesis dm10 Studio kit! Triggering into Superior 2.0?
« Reply #14 on: January 09, 2011, 09:12:10 AM »
been busy for a while but finally got some time to look into crosstalk,  well that was not the problem either. i am sooooo stumped!!!  :'(

Are you sure that your mapping in SD hasn't the same MIDI note assigned to more than one instrument?? I.e. Crash 1 and 2 have the same note assigned? Or are there any "MIDI nodes" (nodes, not notes!!) in your preset that will combine different instruments for one articulation?

Re: New Alesis dm10 Studio kit! Triggering into Superior 2.0?
« Reply #15 on: January 09, 2011, 06:03:00 PM »
i dont THINK so?? ive never done EDrum triggering, always manually input in the grid with drums... ill look into that.... after i figure out how ha

Offline vaikl

Re: New Alesis dm10 Studio kit! Triggering into Superior 2.0?
« Reply #16 on: January 09, 2011, 06:33:40 PM »
Funnily enough I had a similar prob today with a new library in BFD2 :D
My Tom3 was triggering both floor toms in the BFD-kit, no matter what parameters were tweaked on the DM10.

Short look in the BFD MIDI key map and there were competing entries for both toms which could be a result of loading a complete kit preset together with a custom DM10 MIDI key mapping AND a stock kit on the DM10. Using a stock kit can become irritating because of the two layers A and B, which together can contain two different MIDI notes for one pad (or even more, if using the CHORD/ARP options).

So - the hardest but cleanest way to get a fine triggering setup is to use an empty User kit on the DM10 and then map the triggers one by one to the biggest kit in your sample software (big = highest number of parts/toms etc.).

Re: New Alesis dm10 Studio kit! Triggering into Superior 2.0?
« Reply #17 on: January 10, 2011, 06:17:18 AM »
so, that didnt work but i just went in and changed midi notes to fit rather than "learning" superior to match my dm10. had to keep ride crash and hi hat though. now i gotta figure out how to trigger my hi hat, ive heard everyone has problems with that starting out. got any tips?

Offline vaikl

Re: New Alesis dm10 Studio kit! Triggering into Superior 2.0?
« Reply #18 on: January 10, 2011, 07:06:59 AM »
now i gotta figure out how to trigger my hi hat, ive heard everyone has problems with that starting out. got any tips?

Page 47 in the SD manual describes the appropriate procedure very detailed. The DM10 value for the HatsCtrl is CC04 and the other values can be found out best by using the first tip on recording a short MIDI sequence.

It's a bit hard work, yes, but this is valid for all edrums out there.

Re: New Alesis dm10 Studio kit! Triggering into Superior 2.0?
« Reply #19 on: January 11, 2011, 10:30:35 AM »
Quote
It's not letting my two crashes trigger separate things. I'll learn left crash to my crash 1 and then right crash to me crash 2. Then my crash 1 will trigger the right crash as well. I cannot find any way to let them trigger separately into superior. Same thing happens with my right rack Tom and floor Tom... Getting quite frustrated.
Quote
so, that didnt work but i just went in and changed midi notes to fit rather than "learning" superior to match my dm10. had to keep ride crash and hi hat though.

CF,

When using MIDI Learn in S2.0, you will get (for example) Tom 1 and Tom 2 triggering the same drums samples if you assign Tom 1 to Left and Tom 2 to Right. Left and Right articulations are supposed to be mapped to the same drum pad like "left and right hand playing". See what I mean? Try just assigning Tom 1 (in the Instrument drop down menu) to Left (in the Articulation drop down menu) and then select Tom 2 (in the Instrument drop down menu) and assign it to Left (in the Articulation drop down menu).

Try to pay attention to which pad you're mapping to by choosing the right Instrument in Superior.

Mark

Re: New Alesis dm10 Studio kit! Triggering into Superior 2.0?
« Reply #20 on: January 11, 2011, 09:21:37 PM »
vaikl, thank you so much for helping me through this, youre a lifesaver!

markmcg, yeah, i got it working now though. i didnt do that procedure, but its working fine. just gotta do hi hats now. hopefully what vaikl told me will help.
is the procedure you told me a better procedure for mapping than what i did?

Re: New Alesis dm10 Studio kit! Triggering into Superior 2.0?
« Reply #21 on: January 12, 2011, 12:47:59 AM »
So, i could not figure this hi hat thing out AT ALL. i went through recording sequences like my DM10 manual told me to figure out the midi nots of the different values of life and closure of my pedal while hitting the hi hat and it was a failure. i could only view the grid showing it was hi hat. in the manual it says change it to accomp. then edit, to view the notes, velocity etc. when i did that it would send me a message that there is nothing to edit. so i went to a previous sequence that it would pull up correctly, recorded, and then went to it. recorded 5 bars. when i went to edit accomp. to view it, it just so happened to start at the 6th bar. when i record anything it will not view in the accomp. mode.  so now i am stuck without knowing what the midi values are... please help!!!  :'(

Offline vaikl

Re: New Alesis dm10 Studio kit! Triggering into Superior 2.0?
« Reply #22 on: January 12, 2011, 05:24:37 PM »
CopperFox, to see all MIDI notes and CC values that will be sent during recording the DM10 module's sequencer isn't the right device. It only shows that there is a HiHat trigger, not which note or CC value will be sent over MIDI. I'm even not sure if it's real MIDI what is displayed there.

To get a better picture you should try to record your HiHat on a MIDI track in Reaper itself.

Re: New Alesis dm10 Studio kit! Triggering into Superior 2.0?
« Reply #23 on: January 13, 2011, 02:50:37 AM »
GOT IT!!!!!!!! THANK YOU VAIKL! You are the reason it is working, period!