Author Topic: Bending Piezos  (Read 2637 times)

Offline angleraxel

Bending Piezos
« on: April 17, 2011, 06:21:33 PM »
Ok, I knew the topic would catch a few of ya! Now that your here... I have DIY toms that are presently single zone. I recently invested in the DM 10 studio kit and sold my old DM5 with the new alesis pads. I really like my mesh head toms but I want to take advantage of the dual zone feature of the DM10. So today I dug out some old piezos and looked at mounting them on the shell for the rim trigger. I don't have my trs jacks yet but I'm anxious. So the piezo fit perfectly between the screws that hold the truss rods. The washers on the screws lay over the piezo and capture it. Perfect, it won't move an inch and it is rock solid to the shell. BUT it did bend the piezo to the shape of the shell. I don't have a jack to test it to see if it killed it or not. I'm hoping that these piezos can take a little deformation??? It still looks like it is in one piece...no cracks that I can see anyway. Do you think it will still work?
AND.. what is the latest version of the DM10 OS?

Thanks guys!
Jamie
DIY toms, Alesis DM10.

Offline Jermdog

Re: Bending Piezos
« Reply #1 on: April 18, 2011, 08:17:26 AM »
Last question first... the DM10 should ship with the latest OS and updates.  You can check the Alesis site for the date of the last OS update.

As for the piezo... it really depends on the piezo.  Most of them have a very thin ceramic coating on one of the plates.  I've bent a few in the past using them for many other things - I've had mixed results.  Sometimes they worked, sometimes they didn't.  The only way you're going to find out is by hooking it up to a jack and testing it.

If you can get to the lead wires, just tape them onto a TS or TRS plug to test it.  Red is normally the tip or +.
Strike Pro, Dm10, Zildjian Gen 16 hats, xhats and garbage cymbals, Kit Toys chinas, crash and splashes, jam dock, mixer, custom 13" tom, alesis, drum workshop and various hardware.

Offline Hellfire

Re: Bending Piezos
« Reply #2 on: April 18, 2011, 11:28:57 AM »
Jermdog beat me to the punch. Basically, what he said. :)

The problem with bending a piezo is the ceramic can get very small fractures that you can not see. You will know that they are there when you plug the trigger in and every once in a while you will get a very hot (spike) signal for no reason. I hope that helps.

Offline angleraxel

Re: Bending Piezos
« Reply #3 on: April 18, 2011, 01:38:53 PM »
Thanks guys. So what is a good way to mount the piezo for a rim shot? I was hoping to mount it inside the shell somewhere?
DIY toms, Alesis DM10.

Offline Jermdog

Re: Bending Piezos
« Reply #4 on: April 18, 2011, 03:04:35 PM »
You should be able to mount it on the shell or, you can get a thin bracket to mount under the rim (like you are doing with your bent piezo) and mount the piezo to the bracket.

I'd have to pull apart one of my current DM10 realpads to see how Alesis does it.  There are videos on the mesh conversion - that may help you with location.

I would say the biggest thing would be the isolation between the piezos.  You'll be able to use the x-talk settings to help some, but mounting would be key.

Check out the videos on the conversions to help you with location.
Strike Pro, Dm10, Zildjian Gen 16 hats, xhats and garbage cymbals, Kit Toys chinas, crash and splashes, jam dock, mixer, custom 13" tom, alesis, drum workshop and various hardware.

Offline angleraxel

Re: Bending Piezos
« Reply #5 on: April 18, 2011, 07:49:38 PM »
You should be able to mount it on the shell or, you can get a thin bracket to mount under the rim (like you are doing with your bent piezo) and mount the piezo to the bracket.

I'd have to pull apart one of my current DM10 realpads to see how Alesis does it.  There are videos on the mesh conversion - that may help you with location.

I would say the biggest thing would be the isolation between the piezos.  You'll be able to use the x-talk settings to help some, but mounting would be key.

Check out the videos on the conversions to help you with location.
I was told that the rim and head were in different groups thus when one hits it would cancel the other out... in essence no worry about crosstalk. Yes/no??

Jamie
DIY toms, Alesis DM10.

Offline Jermdog

Re: Bending Piezos
« Reply #6 on: April 19, 2011, 08:10:09 AM »
The rims and heads are not in different groups.  They can be set to be in different mute groups so that when you strike one, it mutes the other.  With the dual zone feature, there are setting for zonextalk.  This is the xtalk setting between zones - bell/bow of a ride, or rim/head of a tom/snare.

From what I can tell of my toms/snare, there is one piezo on a strike/reflection plate at the top and another piezo mounted at the bottom (both are in the center relative to the sides).

I'm not 100% sure about the mute functionality - I'm not sure if I've ever hit a rim and head at the same time.  I may have... if it muted and I didn't realize I hit both, then I would know anyway!

I would try what you already have to see if it works before changing it up.  As I stated before, you can always tape the leads to a TRS cable to try it out... just hit the head and rim fairly lightly... as to avoid a disconnect.

I hope this helps you.
Strike Pro, Dm10, Zildjian Gen 16 hats, xhats and garbage cymbals, Kit Toys chinas, crash and splashes, jam dock, mixer, custom 13" tom, alesis, drum workshop and various hardware.

Offline angleraxel

Re: Bending Piezos
« Reply #7 on: April 22, 2011, 04:10:20 PM »
Well all is well. After close examination it looks like the out side rim of the piezo conformed to the shape of the shell and the ceramic stayed straight. I got my jacks from digikey yesterday and today I piped it all up and ...it worked! Here are a few pics of the first attempts. I used hot glue to make a strain relief for the small wires. I smothered the wires on the piezos. Since I have had a few break there on occasion. I also use the hot glue inside the heat shrink where I joined the small diameter piezo wires to the larger diameter jack wires. I hadn't been able to find a heat shrink locally that would accommodate the jack wires and yet shrink down to the piezo wires. This seems like it might work.
DIY toms, Alesis DM10.

Offline Jermdog

Re: Bending Piezos
« Reply #8 on: April 22, 2011, 06:04:18 PM »
Nice job there.  I'm glad everything worked out for you.
Strike Pro, Dm10, Zildjian Gen 16 hats, xhats and garbage cymbals, Kit Toys chinas, crash and splashes, jam dock, mixer, custom 13" tom, alesis, drum workshop and various hardware.