Author Topic: 12“ Mesh Head Conversion / only with foam / step by step / incl. videos  (Read 39526 times)

Offline Coyote_84

Thanks for sharing this excellent and professional documentation. I will definately give it a try!

Offline drumday

  • Ultimate Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 516
  • Total likes: 0
  • Why my ears ring & why I'm going edrum!
Re: 12“ Mesh Head Conversion / only with foam / step by step / incl. videos
« Reply #51 on: October 07, 2013, 10:41:54 PM »
I think I'll venture over to the hobby shop and try this for my 12" I just got.  It's 5mm, and cheap, looks denser.  http://woodlandscenics.woodlandscenics.com/show/Item/ST1477/page/1.  In no particular hurry, so if anybody knows why this won't be an acceptable foam to try, please let me know.  Thanks.

dd
DM10 Studio 2011, BBII mesh conversion w/ resistors left in place, Simmons DA200S, ProMark 7A nylon, Sennheiser HD280 headphones, Gibraltar rack, Camco double pedal.

Offline Puglatin

Re: 12“ Mesh Head Conversion / only with foam / step by step / incl. videos
« Reply #52 on: October 12, 2013, 10:07:13 PM »
I tried a couple experiments, one being putting in two layers of funky foam (with holes cut out) on the bottom under the sensor plate then the original foam on top.  Didn't work at all.

I noted the foam on the back of the sensor plate being much more rubbery than the 8" and 10" pads.  I'm guessing that's what everyone keeps likening to a mouse pad.

A few people have mentioned the speaker grill foam wearing out over time.  I continue to look for a more permanent 1/4" foam.

Has anyone else had issue with 682 12" heads being a bit too small under the rim?  One of my keeps slipping out from the rim while playing.

Many thanks, Gerdy!

Offline envisionelec

Re: 12“ Mesh Head Conversion / only with foam / step by step / incl. videos
« Reply #53 on: November 04, 2013, 09:09:53 PM »
I tried a couple experiments, one being putting in two layers of funky foam (with holes cut out) on the bottom under the sensor plate then the original foam on top.  Didn't work at all.

I noted the foam on the back of the sensor plate being much more rubbery than the 8" and 10" pads.  I'm guessing that's what everyone keeps likening to a mouse pad.

A few people have mentioned the speaker grill foam wearing out over time.  I continue to look for a more permanent 1/4" foam.

Has anyone else had issue with 682 12" heads being a bit too small under the rim?  One of my keeps slipping out from the rim while playing.

Many thanks, Gerdy!

Yep! Me too! I contacted 682 and they replied with the following:

"Unfortunately there are some Alesis kits on the market with a 12 inch hoop that is a little bit too big. In almost all cases our heads fit like a glove on Alesis 12 inch pads, but on some 12 inch pads they pop out of the hoop.
 
Just last week we found a possible solution. We have a thick foam tape that can be attached to the hoop of the mesh head, so it doesn’t pop out any more.
 
We will send you these materials for free. Please let me know if this solves your problem. If it doesn’t, you can still ship them back and you will get a refund."

Greg

  • Guest
Re: 12“ Mesh Head Conversion / only with foam / step by step / incl. videos
« Reply #54 on: November 06, 2013, 05:04:25 AM »
I tried a couple experiments, one being putting in two layers of funky foam (with holes cut out) on the bottom under the sensor plate then the original foam on top.  Didn't work at all.

I noted the foam on the back of the sensor plate being much more rubbery than the 8" and 10" pads.  I'm guessing that's what everyone keeps likening to a mouse pad.

A few people have mentioned the speaker grill foam wearing out over time.  I continue to look for a more permanent 1/4" foam.

Has anyone else had issue with 682 12" heads being a bit too small under the rim?  One of my keeps slipping out from the rim while playing.

Many thanks, Gerdy!

Yep! Me too! I contacted 682 and they replied with the following:

"Unfortunately there are some Alesis kits on the market with a 12 inch hoop that is a little bit too big. In almost all cases our heads fit like a glove on Alesis 12 inch pads, but on some 12 inch pads they pop out of the hoop.
 
Just last week we found a possible solution. We have a thick foam tape that can be attached to the hoop of the mesh head, so it doesn’t pop out any more.
 
We will send you these materials for free. Please let me know if this solves your problem. If it doesn’t, you can still ship them back and you will get a refund."


Noooooooooo!!!! 682drums is handing you bs. The gurus here and myself discussed this many months ago. We put on Standard Remo mylar heads to see if it was the rim and it wasn't. The rim is fine. 682drums 12" heads are too small to stop from popping out. 682drums isn't being upfront about this problem. They offer the tape as a cheap alternative to make their 12" heads stay in place.

Offline speedstar808

Re: 12“ Mesh Head Conversion / only with foam / step by step / incl. videos
« Reply #55 on: December 09, 2013, 03:32:22 AM »
Hey Greg,

I just ordered the 682 mesh heads, should I cancel the order? what other 2ply mesh heads are available that fit well, beside the Roland?

thx

Offline Hellfire

Re: 12“ Mesh Head Conversion / only with foam / step by step / incl. videos
« Reply #56 on: December 09, 2013, 07:08:14 AM »
Hey Greg,

I just ordered the 682 mesh heads, should I cancel the order? what other 2ply mesh heads are available that fit well, beside the Roland?

thx

Unfortunately Greg is no longer a member here at DMdrummer.com. :( So he will not be answering.

You can use Billy Blast 3ply heads. Here's a link:

Ballistech II White Mesh Heads
For more edrum info, be sure to visit my web site at:
          www.HellfireDrums.com                    
My current set-up:  Alesis DM10 and Trigger I/O with modified & DIY pads

Offline MRTL

Re: 12“ Mesh Head Conversion / only with foam / step by step / incl. videos
« Reply #57 on: December 09, 2013, 05:02:02 PM »
Thanks for helping me with this topic!!!!!!
DM10 Studio Kit:
I did not remove the resistors and did no soldering,
The sound and the playing are better, the noise is reduced and is verry acceptable!

thx


Offline eratz

Re: 12“ Mesh Head Conversion / only with foam / step by step / incl. videos
« Reply #58 on: December 10, 2013, 08:54:46 AM »
Hey Greg,

I just ordered the 682 mesh heads, should I cancel the order? what other 2ply mesh heads are available that fit well, beside the Roland?

thx

Unfortunately Greg is no longer a member here at DMdrummer.com. :( So he will not be answering.

You can use Billy Blast 3ply heads. Here's a link:

Ballistech II White Mesh Heads

I have had problems with the 12" heads fitting properly on my DM10X....Buyer beware.
DM10X, Trigger I/O, Billy Blast II Ballistech Heads, Dampened Rack, Custom Tennis Ball Isolation Riser, Simmons DA200S,  Scarlett 2i2, Roland BT-1, Pintech Dingbats x2, DW 3000 Double Pedal, Extra Alesis Ride, Additional Alesis Crash cymbals, Roc-n-Soc Drum Throne.

"Hit 'em hard and hit 'em often

Offline JimmyB

Re: 12“ Mesh Head Conversion / only with foam / step by step / incl. videos
« Reply #59 on: December 10, 2013, 11:08:21 AM »
If both the 682 and Billy Blast 12" heads are slipping out of the rim, it must be bad rims. When my 682 heads arrive I will measure the heads against the stock Mylar.

Offline speedstar808

Re: 12“ Mesh Head Conversion / only with foam / step by step / incl. videos
« Reply #60 on: December 11, 2013, 12:56:10 PM »
I received the same email from 628 about using the thick tape to fix the issue. Has anyone successfully used this tape to remedy the issue? Any other successful methods out there to make the 628 12" heads fit/work properly????

Thx

I tried a couple experiments, one being putting in two layers of funky foam (with holes cut out) on the bottom under the sensor plate then the original foam on top.  Didn't work at all.

I noted the foam on the back of the sensor plate being much more rubbery than the 8" and 10" pads.  I'm guessing that's what everyone keeps likening to a mouse pad.

A few people have mentioned the speaker grill foam wearing out over time.  I continue to look for a more permanent 1/4" foam.

Has anyone else had issue with 682 12" heads being a bit too small under the rim?  One of my keeps slipping out from the rim while playing.

Many thanks, Gerdy!

Yep! Me too! I contacted 682 and they replied with the following:

"Unfortunately there are some Alesis kits on the market with a 12 inch hoop that is a little bit too big. In almost all cases our heads fit like a glove on Alesis 12 inch pads, but on some 12 inch pads they pop out of the hoop.
 
Just last week we found a possible solution. We have a thick foam tape that can be attached to the hoop of the mesh head, so it doesn’t pop out any more.
 
We will send you these materials for free. Please let me know if this solves your problem. If it doesn’t, you can still ship them back and you will get a refund."

Offline Dobly

Re: 12“ Mesh Head Conversion / only with foam / step by step / incl. videos
« Reply #61 on: January 28, 2014, 09:36:50 PM »
I recently got a full set of 682Drums mesh heads for my DM10X kit.

For 10" drums I used Hellfire's method without soldering. This worked great on my 2 toms.

My 12" drums were another matter. First, the 682 Drums 12" mesh heads don't fit the 12" DM10X pads.  They sent me some thick rubber tape to put around the mesh head. Time will tell how this holds up.

Next I bought the foam as described by Gerdy at the start of this thread.
The only foam I could find was 6mm. This seemed to work out perfectly as you'll see below.

Below you can see my white markings on the new foam. At the top of the shot you can see the foam that came out of the 12" pad. I could not help but notice that the hole in the original foam was much bigger than what I marked. The size of my center holes btw made around the bottom of a spindle of cds. ie: a few mm bigger than a cd. Still way smaller that the original.



Here you can see that difference better



After putting 2 sheets of 6mm reticulated foam at the bottom, then the tirgger, finally the whole piece of 6mm foam, this was the side view I had.



Looks pretty perfect to me.

Finally here is a shot of the 12" mesh head (upside down on the floor) with it's rubber tape installed ready to put on the drum.



I'll report back if I have any problems with this rubber tape 'bandaid' solution.

Thus far I have only tested the snare drum. The result is amazing. Not only does it feel better and it quieter to play but it is more responsive and sensitive to soft strokes.

THANKS Gerdy ! ! !

For any Aussies who what to get this foam, I got it here. Just $55AU

http://foamandrubber.com.au/foam/filter-foam/a-c-filter-foam-28-30-reticulated-med-sheet-2m-x-1m.html
« Last Edit: January 28, 2014, 09:38:42 PM by Dobly »

Offline JimmyB

Re: 12“ Mesh Head Conversion / only with foam / step by step / incl. videos
« Reply #62 on: January 28, 2014, 10:47:15 PM »
I ended up using a rim from a broken head and supergluing it to the mesh head rim to keep it in the hoop
JimmyB

Offline Dobly

Re: 12“ Mesh Head Conversion / only with foam / step by step / incl. videos
« Reply #63 on: January 29, 2014, 08:48:04 PM »
I ended up using a rim from a broken head and supergluing it to the mesh head rim to keep it in the hoop
JimmyB

You superglued what to where? I'm just trying to picture this and imagine any glue strong enough to hold that.. Don't suppose you have an image of how you did this. I have a whole kit of mylar head ready to hack up for this if it is a better solution to the sticky rubber strips.

Offline JimmyB

Re: 12“ Mesh Head Conversion / only with foam / step by step / incl. videos
« Reply #64 on: January 29, 2014, 09:33:45 PM »
I superglued the rim of a broken head on top of the 682 rim. That way the proper sized rim ends up against the 12 inch hoop
It's held up nicely for a month and a half of a ton of playing
JimmyB

Offline stratocaster

Re: 12“ Mesh Head Conversion / only with foam / step by step / incl. videos
« Reply #65 on: January 30, 2014, 11:33:03 AM »
Do you really need the glue? It seems like the clamping tension of the lugs will hold the hoop in place.

Offline JimmyB

Re: 12“ Mesh Head Conversion / only with foam / step by step / incl. videos
« Reply #66 on: January 30, 2014, 03:43:17 PM »
Probably don't need the glue. I'm just picky.
JimmyB

Offline Dobly

Re: 12“ Mesh Head Conversion / only with foam / step by step / incl. videos
« Reply #67 on: February 02, 2014, 11:46:31 PM »
I superglued the rim of a broken head on top of the 682 rim. That way the proper sized rim ends up against the 12 inch hoop
It's held up nicely for a month and a half of a ton of playing
JimmyB

If you put a rim on top of the 682 rim, would that not make the mesh head sit one rim height lower than the rim?

Offline JimmyB

Re: 12“ Mesh Head Conversion / only with foam / step by step / incl. videos
« Reply #68 on: February 03, 2014, 08:45:05 AM »
It does. I did the 10" as well so they match.
JimmyB

Offline Dobly

Re: 12“ Mesh Head Conversion / only with foam / step by step / incl. videos
« Reply #69 on: February 21, 2014, 04:55:00 AM »
Well, it's been a few weeks and I must admit I'm not having a good time with the mesh heads on the 12" drums. Especially the snare.

What seems to have happened is the sound volume when playing from soft to loud seems out of wack. Let me explain.

Imagine that I play the drums where 100 is as hard as I play, and 20 is the softest I play.. If i play the drum at 20 and gradually start hitting harder and harder, the volume jumps from 50 to 80 as the sound suddenly changes thanks to that thing the DM10 does for different power strokes.

There is no in between. It's like the 6mm of foam I have on top is preventing my hit from registering properly until I am playing harder. Once that threshold is broken, the drums triggers back to normal.

When I put the drum together, the metal/rubber trigger pad was flush with the top of the shell. The 6mm of foam sat on that and got squashed down by the mesh head. I did the head tight enough, then very tight to see if that fixed the problem. The problem persists.

This did not happen with the original, loud and horrible mylar head.

It makes playing grooves like Rosanna by Toto sound wrong, as the ghost notes are too quiet and out of balance with normal playing.

Likewise I played a simple parradiddle R l r r L r l l with accents on the first Right and first Left at the start of each, and it sound wrong. The lesser notes are too soft. it's like the accents are at 90 and the lesser strokes at 30 (when I expect them to be 50 or 60). For the way I play it is unplayable.

What can I do here? Is this some setting that can be adjusted? The Sensitivity is at about 26 and only maxes out if I play at 100. So I think that at least is right.

Any ideas would be much appreciated.
« Last Edit: February 21, 2014, 04:58:07 AM by Dobly »

Offline Trondster

Re: 12“ Mesh Head Conversion / only with foam / step by step / incl. videos
« Reply #70 on: February 21, 2014, 08:04:01 AM »
Try more foam at the bottom, pressing the top layers up against the mesh head.

And - do experiment with different curves.
DM10 Pro kit with dampened rack, extra crashes, mesh heads, Gibraltar stands, P2002C and a dream cherry snare by Diamond Drums.

Offline JimmyB

Re: 12“ Mesh Head Conversion / only with foam / step by step / incl. videos
« Reply #71 on: February 21, 2014, 09:04:46 AM »
You only need around 3mm of foam on the shallow 12 inch drums  I think the thicker foam was keeping the plate from vibrating properly.
JimmyB

Offline Dobly

Re: 12“ Mesh Head Conversion / only with foam / step by step / incl. videos
« Reply #72 on: February 21, 2014, 06:45:44 PM »
I've tried a few combinations now with no luck..

First I tried the method that started this thread with 2 x 5mm foam at the bottom with holes, then the trigger plate then a full 5mm piece of foam at the top. I could only get 6mm foam but other than that it did not work. The problem there was the top foam was only 'just' clear of the rim and therefore good contact was not made with the head and trigger plate.

Next one I tried (and the one that prompted my earlier post), was 6mm AND the original 15mm of foam at the bottom, then the trigger. This put the trigger plate flush with the top of the rim. Then the 6mm foam went on and the sandwich got squashed down by the head. My guess here is that the trigger plate go choked under the pressure. Causing that velocity problem.

Just now I have tried another version. Now it has 3 x 6mm of the reticulated foam at the bottom, then the trigger plate then the whole piece of foam at the top. The top foam with this configuration was sitting 3 to 4 mm high of the top of the rim. Seemed perfect, but the head had DEAD spots all around the center. Works fine as long as I hit dead center every time. (not likely).

I'm at my wits end with this.

Next I'll try 1 x 3mm craft foam and 2 x 6mm reticulated foam at the bottom, then the trigger then the 6mm of foam at the top. Fingers crossed.



Offline JimmyB

Re: 12“ Mesh Head Conversion / only with foam / step by step / incl. videos
« Reply #73 on: February 21, 2014, 07:32:16 PM »
All I did with mine was add 3mm on top. I didn't changed anything on the bottom. Just added the foam, the mesh, tightened them nicely. All three trigger perfectly from light to hard.
My thresholds and retriggers are at twenty and sensitivity is 30
JimmyB

Offline AlanK

Re: 12“ Mesh Head Conversion / only with foam / step by step / incl. videos
« Reply #74 on: February 21, 2014, 07:52:10 PM »
Just throwing in my 2 cents... I ordered the white mesh set from 682Drums for my DM10X and I've had no issues installing or playing them whatsoever. They went on perfectly, the fit is perfect and the triggering is pretty much working without adjustment (one tweak for the rim on my snare, the rest of the rims worked fine as they were). I wonder if the size problem is only with the black sets?
DM10X with Pro X hi-hat, original hat used for 3rd crash, 682 white mesh cone conversion, Laurin Drums 12" snare and kick, Mapex P710W double kick pedal, Tama saddle, Panasonic noise cancelling headphones, Behringer 8 channel USB mixer, Tascam 144MK AI, Samson Expedition Escape powered speakers