Author Topic: Problem with new strike 2 new kits wont load effects  (Read 2236 times)

Offline Purpledc

Problem with new strike 2 new kits wont load effects
« on: February 03, 2018, 08:46:05 AM »
If this has been discussed I apologize.   My problem is with the new drum kits that loaded into the module with the update.  On my unit both the new kits, one being "phatty" and the other being "natural" wont load any effects or reverb with that sound.  I can only use them dry.   What am I doing wrong?

Offline Chaser

Re: Problem with new strike 2 new kits wont load effects
« Reply #1 on: February 03, 2018, 09:42:57 AM »
If this has been discussed I apologize.   My problem is with the new drum kits that loaded into the module with the update.  On my unit both the new kits, one being "phatty" and the other being "natural" wont load any effects or reverb with that sound.  I can only use them dry.   What am I doing wrong?
You also have to go into [Voice] > [FX/MIDI] ...you can turn eq/compression on/off.. and adjust the sends per Trigger... Reverb, FX1 and FX2.
By default they are 0 ( Zero)
http://www.alesisdrummer.com/index.php?topic=7453.msg50155#msg50155

Offline Purpledc

Re: Problem with new strike 2 new kits wont load effects
« Reply #2 on: February 03, 2018, 10:24:48 AM »
ah hah.  So basically I'm an idiot.   Thank you, lol.     a couple other questions if you don't mind.

1.  I find some kits like the 01 rock in kit   sounds nothing like product demos.   Is it possible they turned off the effects to showcase those sounds?

2.  Is there any settings to adjust things like muffling?   I'm basically looking to tighten the sound and make something sound like a muffled kit rather than really boomy.     The only thing I found was to shorten the decay time.  This works quite well (and much better than previous alesis kits) but I thought maybe I may be missing something.

thanks in advance.  You have been very helpful

Offline Chaser

Re: Problem with new strike 2 new kits wont load effects
« Reply #3 on: February 03, 2018, 10:59:53 AM »
ah hah.  So basically I'm an idiot.   Thank you, lol.     a couple other questions if you don't mind.

1.  I find some kits like the 01 rock in kit   sounds nothing like product demos.   Is it possible they turned off the effects to showcase those sounds?

2.  Is there any settings to adjust things like muffling?   I'm basically looking to tighten the sound and make something sound like a muffled kit rather than really boomy.     The only thing I found was to shorten the decay time.  This works quite well (and much better than previous alesis kits) but I thought maybe I may be missing something.

thanks in advance.  You have been very helpful

No ones an idiot..except maybe ..Alesis...the change logs on updates are poor they assume the user will know how to implement them.I am seeing a lot of STRIKE purchases are for 1st time E-kit owners.

One thing you can do so you can really hear changes and it will dramatically increase the volume/ allow full range of the faders is to go into each voice on the kit you're using  under [level] to 99..then press [Velocity] and set to 0...0 will get MAX volume..99 minimum.
You'll understand once you set it.

At 0 it will be loud you won't have as much control/response (lower/slower) over all the velocity (Dynamics) parameters
..filter decay,pitch..increasing the velocity level will increase their response..somewhere between 0-50 seems to be the sweet spot for velocity loudness/volume and parameters..but consider I am also using custom/DIY Cymbals and the older Realheads/reflection plate with the mesh conversion , not the newer triggering .  .You may possibly notice the modules output click/pop as the trigger signal is now very hot.
I found it easier for me to set the loudness/volume of the kit/triggers first,setting the faders in the middle so I had some control range later( instead of the faders pegged at the top and having to later go into settings after settings triggers) and change levels etc . then gradually work out the trigger settings one by one..isolating each zone , then deal with retrigger crosstalk etc...I prefer having dry kit's, or having articulations/samples with the FX already applied and the processing power for reducing the loading time.. FX seems to add to the loading time of the kit's and are added last.
A muffled head might have to be an articulation/voice.I haven't tried to muffle, I'll see if I can.Have you tried going into [Tone] ?

I have mainly been focused on building a data base and experimenting with spectrum analyzers to see actual affect/impact of the controls/settings in the module.The goal is while building the samples/articulations ,to get the knobs/settings in the module close to midpoints (12 o'clock) where possible instead of extremes.That way you would have more range of control.The module is capable of doing quite a bit as you can create really good sounds/articulations..but can also turn a good one to crap by a small or wrong adjustment/twist of a knob
Alesis would be wise to have online tutorial/classes for the STRIKE module or a video series they'd see more kit's and improve relations instead of filling up their forum with constant complaints on the basics,it would also more than likely reduce all the returns I am seeing.
The 1st time E-kit owners are impatient ...returning kits and buying other brands mainly Roland.
« Last Edit: February 03, 2018, 05:17:44 PM by Chaser »

Offline Purpledc

Re: Problem with new strike 2 new kits wont load effects
« Reply #4 on: February 03, 2018, 03:26:42 PM »
Yeah some tutorials would be awesome.  I just started in dec and i was coming from a nitro and forge.  So this is new to me.   I just notice the bass drum sounds are what is really different to my ears.  My rock and roll kit just sounds like a tinny smack sound with no lo end or any thump.  I almost thought something was wrong.  I just see all these demos where people are getting these killer sounds i cant srrm to get and the difference is dramatic.  Makes me wonder if my updates didnt take properly.  And like my NAC kit.  The bass drum seriously is so short it sounds just like a plastic beater smacking a skin with no thump or timbre.    I just wish in the product demos they said what they did to get that sound as its nothing like mine stock.   But im also using headphonesbut they at ath40s so they arent the problem.   Im not giving up though.  I know the sounds are in there,  i just have no idea how to unlock the potential as i literally have no idea what does what.   I want an easy button.  Like select a kit and have a selection with preset optimization of all parameters for a particular sound.  Like a “tight and muted”  or a “loose and boomy”.   You know  presets that would actually dial in certain parameters for those who like jon snow and I know nothing.   Like you seem to know exactly how to get in there and how to tweak things.  For me having some parameter presets would go a long way in not only getting the sound i want but also being able to see those settings would give me a reference for how certain tones are created.   Either that or we need to see people start selling preset packs.

Offline Dartanbeck

Re: Problem with new strike 2 new kits wont load effects
« Reply #5 on: February 03, 2018, 03:59:39 PM »
I know that the e-drum modules have to include Kit presets to show off what they can do out-of-the-box, but I doubt I'd find a preset on any e-drum product from any company that would work for me as-is.

I actually haven't even heard all of the preset kits on my DM10X yet. Almost immediately, I found one that was kinda similar to what I was looking for without being at all picky, and saved it to the first user preset slot and then go in and start tweaking!

Yeah, that DM10 MKII had a Muffling feature... I bet that was kinda cool. In fact, that module looks pretty sweet. No Strike... but it looks like it was set up to be easy to tune-in custom drum sounds pretty well. Can't tell for sure, though, without actually messing with it!

Just out of curiosity, have you checked out the videos on the Alesis site regarding setting up and using the Strike kit?

For stuff like this, too... it's always a great thing to have a hard-copy of the manual and read it through at least twice, and then re-read parts as you need to.  E-drums have a lot to them to make them tick. This was true even when everyone thought they sucked.
Alesis DM10X Mesh - Laurin Drums & Cymbals - Strike Module
Dartanbeck.com Digital Artist

Offline Chaser

Re: Problem with new strike 2 new kits wont load effects
« Reply #6 on: February 03, 2018, 04:09:11 PM »
Yeah some tutorials would be awesome.  I just started in dec and i was coming from a nitro and forge.  So this is new to me.   I just notice the bass drum sounds are what is really different to my ears.  My rock and roll kit just sounds like a tinny smack sound with no lo end or any thump.  I almost thought something was wrong.  I just see all these demos where people are getting these killer sounds i cant srrm to get and the difference is dramatic.  Makes me wonder if my updates didnt take properly.  And like my NAC kit.  The bass drum seriously is so short it sounds just like a plastic beater smacking a skin with no thump or timbre.    I just wish in the product demos they said what they did to get that sound as its nothing like mine stock.   But im also using headphonesbut they at ath40s so they arent the problem.   Im not giving up though.  I know the sounds are in there,  i just have no idea how to unlock the potential as i literally have no idea what does what.   I want an easy button.  Like select a kit and have a selection with preset optimization of all parameters for a particular sound.  Like a “tight and muted”  or a “loose and boomy”.   You know  presets that would actually dial in certain parameters for those who like jon snow and I know nothing.   Like you seem to know exactly how to get in there and how to tweak things.  For me having some parameter presets would go a long way in not only getting the sound i want but also being able to see those settings would give me a reference for how certain tones are created.   Either that or we need to see people start selling preset packs.

For the 001 Rock'n kit I noticed the kick has an articulation/sample for both Layer A and B..metal 2..metal 1...metal kick's probably aren't what you are looking for..the videos you have seen with "killer sounds" have probably changed the articulations/samples and saved as the factory named kit.

go to [Voice]>[Inst]..you see at the bottom of the page Layer A..Layer B..when you select a layer a window opens with a list of instruments on the left.. samples on the right highlight Kick...then use the up/down pad to scroll through the articulations/samples on the window on the right highlight a articulation/sample as you highlight samples..strike the kick to audition them when you have one you like then click [Back]..to adjust the level etc etc
there is a  "muffle" in there you asked about earlier...

I know that the e-drum modules have to include Kit presets to show off what they can do out-of-the-box, but I doubt I'd find a preset on any e-drum product from any company that would work for me as-is.


There isn't an aftermarket  preset samples or an interactive data base for the STRIKE module..... yet...  ;)
It is quite possible to duplicate Artist kits from songs and albums and turn into presets..
« Last Edit: February 03, 2018, 06:04:25 PM by Chaser »

Offline Purpledc

Re: Problem with new strike 2 new kits wont load effects
« Reply #7 on: February 03, 2018, 04:22:20 PM »
chaser you are my effin hero.   I was totally incorrect in how that all worked.  When I was looking in that menu I just thought that was me choosing a different instrument from a different kit all together.  I didn't realize all those kick sounds were actually part of that kit.   This thing is actually a lot cooler than I initially thought.   Thank you so much, this has been a huge help

Offline Chaser

Re: Problem with new strike 2 new kits wont load effects
« Reply #8 on: February 03, 2018, 04:32:12 PM »
chaser you are my effin hero.   I was totally incorrect in how that all worked.  When I was looking in that menu I just thought that was me choosing a different instrument from a different kit all together.  I didn't realize all those kick sounds were actually part of that kit.   This thing is actually a lot cooler than I initially thought.   Thank you so much, this has been a huge help

You can audition all the samples by striking the kick as you highlight them...make sure in the left window you have kick highlighted..or you'll end up with a hi hat..or cymbal etc as the articulation/sample..as you can assign anything you want instrument or articulation/sample/fx.. anything.

An example of what can be done...select 055 Guitar Rock Kit..play the snare/toms/rim listen to each strike..do multiple strikes on one zone.
check the articulations/samples: Snare center/head-layer A= drum..layer B= guitar....rim=rimshot , Tom 2 drum center/head layer A=drum..layer B=guitar..Rim=splash..etc

Just above the window watch the MEMORY USED..that is the indicator of how much the kit is using...200mb is the limit.

When you start getting into the STRIKE editor and using your own samples/building instruments etc you'll see you can also use velocity switching and place different articulations/samples inside the instrument so different articulations/samples will trigger depending on velocity.
Hellfire posted a Custom Kit as an example http://www.alesisdrummer.com/index.php?topic=7143.0


NOTE:
In Utility menu or Trigger mode..when you hit save.. it will only save the settings.To save a Kit..you must be in the Kit window and a screen will pop up asking you to enter kit name or save changes to that kit.I recommend resaving as a different kit...and save the Factory ones for original reference.
For example..if you are trying to build/duplicate a kit for a song..name the kit to the song.
This will create a .skt file(kit file) and save to your external SD card...when you want to load that kit later..
go to the Kit screen press [USER]..you can then scroll through the kits you have created and load them

You'll also notice a "New Use Kit" when scrolling [USER] on the SD card..that is an empty kit file..no voices etc , it is a template that was setup by Alesis to use as a keymap for Toontrack.You can also use it to build kits entirely from scratch
I use it to build keymaps for pretty much anything I need..BFD3..SD3..EZD2  Kontakt5 and so on.. it is much better and more accurate and allows you to map the STRIKE module to the Software's standard mapping rather than relying on Alesis Key maps(generic) built into some software which are unreliable.
Remember when saving to re-save as a different kit so it remains a blank template.
« Last Edit: February 03, 2018, 08:52:38 PM by Chaser »

Offline Purpledc

Re: Problem with new strike 2 new kits wont load effects
« Reply #9 on: February 03, 2018, 10:02:24 PM »
now did you say you can take the drum sounds from a song?   I would love to know more about that.


Edited to add:    My kick drum is sounding on point.   This thing is amazing.
« Last Edit: February 03, 2018, 10:22:16 PM by Purpledc »

Offline Chaser

Re: Problem with new strike 2 new kits wont load effects
« Reply #10 on: February 04, 2018, 11:25:39 AM »
now did you say you can take the drum sounds from a song?   I would love to know more about that.

The Software/process is much more involved when you start getting into creating velocity wav files from multi-tracks and stems.There is also a very fine line doing all this involving licensing/copyrights,especially if the intention is for public distribution and not for personal use.
Posting them in a public forum isn't recommended.

To avoid all that..you can use a module to trigger existing Drum software in the marketplace or a DAW/Vst with a kit already modeled/sampled then tweak it to the settings used in the recording export it and load into the module.

There are also numerous producer/recording forums/websites today that list equipment/gear used by Artists/bands to record certain albums over the years.Some even have gone so far as to list "recommended" settings/tunings for specific gear even Impulse Responses.

If you look into the presets in some of the Drum software that's available today there are subtle hints to the basis of the preset...but you'll never see an exact definition or an exact replication of a sound.There are also companies that sell multi-velocity wav files like drumwerks http://www.drumwerks.com/ and using additonal software you can adjust them to the specs required of the module.
Most modules out that have the capability of loading wav can only load a single wav file.The STRIKE module is one of the few capable of loading multiple wav.

A good example is the guitar modelers and rack gear today that can almost perfectly duplicate Artist settings,you'll never see "Eddie Van Halen eruption" preset..instead you'll see "Mr Ed's volcano" or similar.Companies like XLN,Toontrack etc have similar naming schemes/pseudonyms.You have to read between the lines...if you can figure out what the preset was based on chances are you can get it close..

Offline Purpledc

Re: Problem with new strike 2 new kits wont load effects
« Reply #11 on: February 04, 2018, 07:57:15 PM »
you know the more I mess with this thing the more I think something is wrong with mine.  I keep watching videos of the presets people are using and mine just sound nothing like what they do.  I would think its just me needing to tweak things but every demo sounds the same.  My kick doesn't sound deep and impactful like the presets do in videos.   Like my 01 rock n roll kit when I hit the kick it sounds metallic like and overshadowed by digital artifacts.   It almost sounds like the kick sounds aren't loading properly.   Is there anyway to re do my updates?   Something seems very wrong.

Offline Chaser

Re: Problem with new strike 2 new kits wont load effects
« Reply #12 on: February 04, 2018, 11:03:32 PM »
you know the more I mess with this thing the more I think something is wrong with mine.  I keep watching videos of the presets people are using and mine just sound nothing like what they do.  I would think its just me needing to tweak things but every demo sounds the same.  My kick doesn't sound deep and impactful like the presets do in videos.   Like my 01 rock n roll kit when I hit the kick it sounds metallic like and overshadowed by digital artifacts.   It almost sounds like the kick sounds aren't loading properly.   Is there anyway to re do my updates?   Something seems very wrong.
Backup your trigger settings if you want to keep them..then download the Editor/update/firmware/content packages..re-install..follow the procedure in the pdf file
http://alesis.com/products/view/strike-pro-kit

added the FAQ page with the video for update process 
http://www.alesis.com/kb/article/2377
« Last Edit: February 04, 2018, 11:08:53 PM by Chaser »

Offline Purpledc

Re: Problem with new strike 2 new kits wont load effects
« Reply #13 on: February 05, 2018, 08:35:12 AM »
Yep.  I have a feeling something got corrupted with my first content update.   Things seemed to have a lot of digital overtones that didn't sound "correct".   I reinstalled the content and the difference was immediate.   I will say their is a stark contrast between the tones used in demos and the tones I got straight out of the box, but after reinstalling the sounds I was able to dial the tones in much easier and changes I make to the sound are coming through.    I think I have that bit ironed out.   Now I just need to learn the unit.   I know the sounds are there.   I just need to learn how to achieve them.   That's ok though.  This is all stuff I need to learn.

Offline Purpledc

Re: Problem with new strike 2 new kits wont load effects
« Reply #14 on: February 07, 2018, 05:19:38 PM »
so.  Reinstalled updates and content update.  Works like a champ.   Looking back I know what I did wrong.  I did the system updates but I pulled the plug early on the content download because I thought it was done.  Some instruments weren't even there and some were jacked up.  Now all is right in the world.   And I notice the sound through my PA is MUCH better than that of headphones.   My PA is just a cheaper alesis made product but labeled an ION.  Sounds great and I'm guessing the presets are dialed in for PA and drum amp set ups.   


I do have one product request if another update happens.  It would be nice to have some type of noise reduction as I notice some line level hum and crap in the background.  During playing it cant be heard.  Might be my PA too.

Offline Dartanbeck

Re: Problem with new strike 2 new kits wont load effects
« Reply #15 on: February 07, 2018, 08:21:52 PM »
I do have one product request if another update happens.  It would be nice to have some type of noise reduction as I notice some line level hum and crap in the background.  During playing it cant be heard.  Might be my PA too.
It's likely that you're in need of a Power Conditioner. My house has a hum that cannot be extinguished. I know nothing of Power Conditioners, but I'm told that's the solution. That or something better.

Of course it might just be a crappy cable in the mix somewhere.
Alesis DM10X Mesh - Laurin Drums & Cymbals - Strike Module
Dartanbeck.com Digital Artist