Realhat pedal doesn't always close.

[marked23]

If I pedal (close & release quickly) the realhat pedal, it makes a nice sustained clang, like it's supposed to.   But if I close the pedal (close & hold), most of the time I get the same sustained clang. 

Sometimes it works like it's supposed to, but it's really frustrating to hear it ring when I'm holding it down.

I've done the calibration several times.  I've tried calibrating it a couple different ways.   However I haven't tried modifying the pedal, like I've seen in other threads.

Is there hope that I can get this figured out?

[BleedingPurist]

I've asked the same question and haven't gotten a helpful response.  I'd lie to know at least if this hi hat behavior is standard for everyone else or if it's a glitch we have. 

It has something to do with resting your heel on the base of the pedal.  Try moving your foot forward so your heel isn't on it or play heel up. 

[Ennuk3]

You have to get used to closing the pedal nice and swiftly, and all the way down, for it to make a chick, instead of the heel splash. Also, don't press too hard, the chick won't be evident then.

[BleedingPurist]

You have to get used to closing the pedal nice and swiftly, and all the way down, for it to make a chick, instead of the heel splash. Also, don't press too hard, the chick won't be evident then.

I'm pretty sure we are both saying that closing the pedal nice and swiftly isn't working or consistent.  Trust me... all the way down and swiftly is not giving consistent response.  You'll get chick chick and then a random splash all while not changing your foot attack. It's not a user technique issue.  I'm figuring it out, but I also know there is nothing natural or intuitive about it.  A splash should go off for one reason.... a quick close and release of the pedal.  That is not what is happening.  Why the hell would I hear a splash when I've completely closed the pedal with no release?  The cymbals are closed!  I've submitted it to Alesis, but no response and it's been over a week. 

I find it hard to believe there aren't more users who know exactly what we are talking about.  It would help to have have people at least step up and admit "Yeah, the pedal is iffy like that... so here is what you have to do to make it work." 

[marked23]

Ok, here are some repro steps;

1) Pedal the hat so that it rings. 
2) While it's ringing, close it. 

Expected: the ringing chokes immediately.

Observed: the sound rings again.

3) pedal the hat so that it rings.
4) close it & hold.
5) open cleanly.
6) close it & hold.
7) open cleanly.
close it & hold.

Expected: on 4,6,8 the DM10 chokes the hat sound.

Observed: on 4,6,8 the DM10 triggers a whole new hat splash sound. 

[Ennuk3]

You have to get used to closing the pedal nice and swiftly, and all the way down, for it to make a chick, instead of the heel splash. Also, don't press too hard, the chick won't be evident then.

I'm pretty sure we are both saying that closing the pedal nice and swiftly isn't working or consistent.  Trust me... all the way down and swiftly is not giving consistent response.  You'll get chick chick and then a random splash all while not changing your foot attack. It's not a user technique issue.  I'm figuring it out, but I also know there is nothing natural or intuitive about it.  A splash should go off for one reason.... a quick close and release of the pedal.  That is not what is happening.  Why the hell would I hear a splash when I've completely closed the pedal with no release?  The cymbals are closed!  I've submitted it to Alesis, but no response and it's been over a week. 

I find it hard to believe there aren't more users who know exactly what we are talking about.  It would help to have have people at least step up and admit "Yeah, the pedal is iffy like that... so here is what you have to do to make it work."

 Yes, and you complaining about a solution is going to help you even further.
You can't expect anything electronic to match their acoustic counterpart, NEVER.
 The only thing that always works, is modifying your technique. Yes, it is uncomfortable and unfavorable, there is no point in blaming everyone else at first without actually analyzing the possibility that you're to blame. Again, I know how hard it is for some people to believe, that they actually have a negative effect on others and themselves.

[BleedingPurist]

You have to get used to closing the pedal nice and swiftly, and all the way down, for it to make a chick, instead of the heel splash. Also, don't press too hard, the chick won't be evident then.

I'm pretty sure we are both saying that closing the pedal nice and swiftly isn't working or consistent.  Trust me... all the way down and swiftly is not giving consistent response.  You'll get chick chick and then a random splash all while not changing your foot attack. It's not a user technique issue.  I'm figuring it out, but I also know there is nothing natural or intuitive about it.  A splash should go off for one reason.... a quick close and release of the pedal.  That is not what is happening.  Why the hell would I hear a splash when I've completely closed the pedal with no release?  The cymbals are closed!  I've submitted it to Alesis, but no response and it's been over a week. 

I find it hard to believe there aren't more users who know exactly what we are talking about.  It would help to have have people at least step up and admit "Yeah, the pedal is iffy like that... so here is what you have to do to make it work."

 Yes, and you complaining about a solution is going to help you even further.
You can't expect anything electronic to match their acoustic counterpart, NEVER.
 The only thing that always works, is modifying your technique. Yes, it is uncomfortable and unfavorable, there is no point in blaming everyone else at first without actually analyzing the possibility that you're to blame. Again, I know how hard it is for some people to believe, that they actually have a negative effect on others and themselves.

While I thank you for trying, your solution is not a solution.  The Hi-Hat pedal is not working as expected or as you describe it.  It is inconsistent.  That is where the frustration is coming from.  I have no problem with the problem being me.... I came into it wondering what I was doing wrong.   Again... pedal does not respond the way you think it is responding. 

Can you answer why a splash would ring at all with the pedal closed and held closed?  Even if it went off inadvertently... shouldn't it cease upon closing the pedal? 

[Drumagination]

I took readings with a voltmeter for Ennuk3 when he was having trouble with his pedal. Go to Drumagination.com, go to the HH circuitry page, and look for Ennuk at the bottom of the page. Downlod the PDF. Use a voltmeter.

I'm guessing that you have an issue with your foot or softpot tape.

Mark

[GeorgePattonIII]

Hey marked23...I highly recommend trying the fix found here: http://www.dmdrummer.com/index.php?topic=2685.0

I was having pretty much the same problem as you, but have more or less solved it through a combination of the fix mentioned above, and through tweaking the settings. So, I can say with confidence that with enough trial and error you should be able to nearly eliminate the problem.

[marked23]

Hey marked23...I highly recommend trying the fix found here: http://www.dmdrummer.com/index.php?topic=2685.0

Ok.  It can't hurt to give it a try.   I don't think that --should-- fix my issue, but it's certainly possible.   Especially if this modification causes some change in the calibration values.

I have some other ideas involving replacing the pot, or adding a bottom-out switch.  But trying the easy mod is harmless to try first.

[Trondster]

The point of the modification is to get rid of the long "dead" travel before the pedal touches the trigger at all. To try it - it is easy and reversible.

[marked23]

I never did modify my pedal.  Still might.   Yes, Trondster, I expected that was the case.

I have made some progress on improving the situation:  I went to my local music store.  I tried their DM10 setup.  I couldn't get their pedal to exhibit the problem. 

I can do it on my kit any time I want to.  But try as I might, I couldn't get the store's pedal to misbehave in the same way.

So I went home and got my pedal.  I hooked up my pedal to their kit.  It worked fine.  Again, I could not make it fail. 

So I expect it must be something in the trigger setup.  I copied the store's trigger settings and went home to try that on my kit.

Xtalk Rcv: 01
XTalk Snd: 04
Retrigger: 15
Threshold: 20

So I put those setting in my module.  And success! It's still not perfect, but it's finally usable.  I can't believe I was using this kit for months and putting up with such bad manners.

Well there you go.  Try that, BleedingPurist.  I'd be interested to know if it helps for you.

-Mark

[Trondster]

Those trigger settings are first and foremost for hitting the hihat cymbal, and not for pressing the pedal.
As well - try recalibrating the pedal with the open and closed positions, and try adjusting the pedal travel curve.

But - perhaps if you had the retrigger setting way too low, it could affect the pedal, but then it should cause problems for the hihat cymbal as well.

Anyway - the important part is that you have solved the issue.

[Alesis But Seriously]

But - perhaps if you had the retrigger setting way too low, it could affect the pedal,...

Could you explain this to me? Do you mean, if retrigger is too low, then the pedal behaviour can be affect as well, because then the cymbal is more "sensitive" as well?

Best,
Daniel

[Trondster]

I'm just guessing - otherwise I can't see how changing the settings would affect the described problem.
Or - it could be (I suspect) that the behaviour hasn't changed at all.

[jontheartguy]

I think I'm feeling happy that I didn't buy my DM8 with pre-conceived notions on how it should function.
I didn't know the hi-hat pedal was manipulated as much as this, tell you the truth. Sounds like there needs to be a heel, full-down, and potentiometer trigger for the thing instead of the setup they have now. Me? I just want a clutch to turn the hi hat all the way on or off.

[marked23]

Those trigger settings are first and foremost for hitting the hihat cymbal, and not for pressing the pedal.

Dough! No wonder it is always so hard to find that menu.  Ok.  False success.

But I do have new information:

When I woke up today, I went to play the kit and noticed that the pedal behavior was worse than ever.  I leave my kit turned on all the time.  It just happened this morning that I thought I should try turning it off, then back on, to see if that makes a difference. 

That made a big difference.  I'm going to try this a few times (over the next few days) and try to confirm that a fresh reboot fixes this.   

[Trondster]

And do take into account that there is quite a bit of travel before the pedal is in contact with the trigger at all, so you have to half-press the pedal to get any reaction at all..

And - shutting it down when you're not using it is probably a good idea.

[marked23]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8R1oEmSnS8o

I made a little video to show my problem.  I press the pedal exactly the same way each time.  Sometimes I get a closing chic.  Sometimes I get a splash.

Is this just something I have to live with?   It sucks.

[Trondster]

As written earlier in the thread: Have you considered trying the simple pedal mod to eliminate the dead travel?

[Burtmeister]

After seeing the video I have to agree with Drumagination it does look like a flakey softpot tape. One other thing though, when you did the calibration did you adjust the trim values there? Theres a tab that says trim. The open and closed values greatly affect heel splashes and toe clicks. As a test I would calibrate your pedal and then go to the trim tab and adjust. I would make the open 10 higher and closed 10 lower just to see if it makes any difference. It should give more of a separation between the two. When I was doing my hihat pedal conversions I had to always tweak these values to get the heel splash and toe clicks working right. Hope that helps.